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Dragon wing failure.

Old 08-15-2010, 08:16 AM
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as722
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Default Dragon wing failure.

I had posted some info on other threads but I decided to start a new one to let anyone who owns a dragon know about the problem. First I'll start by saying I absolutely loved the way the plane flew, last saturday as I was doing a KE pass the left wing came off, after walking to the crash site I noticed the aluminium tab was still attached to the fuse. I was surprised to see that it was VERY short and as the pictures will show it only went into the wing 3/4". I was surprised as I thought it was a lot longer and better secured. I had a few guys tell me to post it on rcu but I decided I would privately e-mail Anton first but he never replied. I then tried to get a hold of him here on rcu but no luck neither even though he answered someone else's question during the same time. I wasn't looking for a discount or a free plane, I've flown long enough to know that as they say ***** happens. All I wanted to know was if he had heard of this before and if I bought another dragon this would not happen again. It's a real shame because I really wanted another one as it really is one of the best kept secrets and excellent value for the money. If you own a dragon please check these tabs !


Albert
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Old 08-15-2010, 08:17 AM
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Default RE: Dragon wing failure.

Some more pictures.
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Old 08-15-2010, 08:36 AM
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Default RE: Dragon wing failure.


ORIGINAL: as722

I had posted some info on other threads but I decided to start a new one to let anyone who owns a dragon know about the problem. First I'll start by saying I absolutely loved the way the plane flew, last saturday as I was doing a KE pass the left wing came off, after walking to the crash site I noticed the aluminium tab was still attached to the fuse. I was surprised to see that it was VERY short and as the pictures will show it only went into the wing 3/4''. I was surprised as I thought it was a lot longer and better secured. I had a few guys tell me to post it on rcu but I decided I would privately e-mail Anton first but he never replied. I then tried to get a hold of him here on rcu but no luck neither even though he answered someone else's question during the same time. I wasn't looking for a discount or a free plane, I've flown long enough to know that as they say ***** happens. All I wanted to know was if he had heard of this before and if I bought another dragon this would not happen again. It's a real shame because I really wanted another one as it really is one of the best kept secrets and excellent value for the money. If you own a dragon please check these tabs !


Albert
Hi, Albert

Sorry for your lost,

I will ask the John tomorrow, why not inform me about your E-mail, and i will ask my staffs for check all Dragon kits again,

Best Regards

Anton
Old 08-15-2010, 08:45 AM
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Default RE: Dragon wing failure.



damhttp://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=9648288&key go to this page . says china glue.has pic of my rudder ..
Old 08-15-2010, 08:46 AM
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Default RE: Dragon wing failure.


ORIGINAL: pilot tw


ORIGINAL: as722

I had posted some info on other threads but I decided to start a new one to let anyone who owns a dragon know about the problem. First I'll start by saying I absolutely loved the way the plane flew, last saturday as I was doing a KE pass the left wing came off, after walking to the crash site I noticed the aluminium tab was still attached to the fuse. I was surprised to see that it was VERY short and as the pictures will show it only went into the wing 3/4''. I was surprised as I thought it was a lot longer and better secured. I had a few guys tell me to post it on rcu but I decided I would privately e-mail Anton first but he never replied. I then tried to get a hold of him here on rcu but no luck neither even though he answered someone else's question during the same time. I wasn't looking for a discount or a free plane, I've flown long enough to know that as they say ***** happens. All I wanted to know was if he had heard of this before and if I bought another dragon this would not happen again. It's a real shame because I really wanted another one as it really is one of the best kept secrets and excellent value for the money. If you own a dragon please check these tabs !


Albert
Hi, Albert

Sorry for your lost,

I will ask the John tomorrow, why not inform me about your E-mail, and i will ask my staffs for check all Dragon kits again,

Best Regards

Anton



Now that I finally got your attention, what are your thought on the pictures ?


Thanks
Albert
Old 08-15-2010, 09:10 AM
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Default RE: Dragon wing failure.


ORIGINAL: pilot tw


ORIGINAL: as722

I had posted some info on other threads but I decided to start a new one to let anyone who owns a dragon know about the problem. First I'll start by saying I absolutely loved the way the plane flew, last saturday as I was doing a KE pass the left wing came off, after walking to the crash site I noticed the aluminium tab was still attached to the fuse. I was surprised to see that it was VERY short and as the pictures will show it only went into the wing 3/4''. I was surprised as I thought it was a lot longer and better secured. I had a few guys tell me to post it on rcu but I decided I would privately e-mail Anton first but he never replied. I then tried to get a hold of him here on rcu but no luck neither even though he answered someone else's question during the same time. I wasn't looking for a discount or a free plane, I've flown long enough to know that as they say ***** happens. All I wanted to know was if he had heard of this before and if I bought another dragon this would not happen again. It's a real shame because I really wanted another one as it really is one of the best kept secrets and excellent value for the money. If you own a dragon please check these tabs !


Albert
Hi, Albert

why not inform me about your E-mail,

Anton
How can he inform you about the e-mail when you don't respond to e-mails.

Albert stated the he sent you an e-mail but you never responded until it hit RCU
Old 08-15-2010, 09:35 AM
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Default RE: Dragon wing failure.


ORIGINAL: pilot tw


ORIGINAL: as722

I had posted some info on other threads but I decided to start a new one to let anyone who owns a dragon know about the problem. First I'll start by saying I absolutely loved the way the plane flew, last saturday as I was doing a KE pass the left wing came off, after walking to the crash site I noticed the aluminium tab was still attached to the fuse. I was surprised to see that it was VERY short and as the pictures will show it only went into the wing 3/4''. I was surprised as I thought it was a lot longer and better secured. I had a few guys tell me to post it on rcu but I decided I would privately e-mail Anton first but he never replied. I then tried to get a hold of him here on rcu but no luck neither even though he answered someone else's question during the same time. I wasn't looking for a discount or a free plane, I've flown long enough to know that as they say ***** happens. All I wanted to know was if he had heard of this before and if I bought another dragon this would not happen again. It's a real shame because I really wanted another one as it really is one of the best kept secrets and excellent value for the money. If you own a dragon please check these tabs !


Albert
Hi, Albert

Sorry for your lost,

I will ask the John tomorrow, why not inform me about your E-mail, and i will ask my staffs for check all Dragon kits again,

Best Regards

Anton
Anton,

How do you plan on fixing the wings that are at the factory already built ? Also you stated on your post that you would have them checked again meaning you already checked them once if so why ? Was there problems in the pass ?
How will the dragon wings already flying be fixed, will you be sending "fix kits" to customers ?

Thanks
Albert
Old 08-15-2010, 10:06 AM
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Default RE: Dragon wing failure.

All good questions Albert!

You know, what's odd is that were your tab pulled out there is no wing material that came with it. The glue stayed secure to the metal but not to the wood in the wing.

That glue joint failed big time!
Old 08-15-2010, 10:07 AM
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Default RE: Dragon wing failure.

At this point I am afraid to fly my Dragon but I can't afford to replace it right now.

Anyone want to buy a Dragon in Ali M. green with a missing canopy?
Old 08-15-2010, 10:08 AM
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Default RE: Dragon wing failure.

More importently! This is an issue on all the skymaster jets that have this alu tab. I had a Sabre that had the same problem. I did mention this to my dealer here in Norway and he sendt this info to Skymaster, this is now about to years ago.......

I did by and build a Dragon but I did sell it before I flown it...... maybe I`m happy.... who knows....
Old 08-15-2010, 10:26 AM
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Default RE: Dragon wing failure.

A number of Vipers lost wings for exactly the same reason. If you were to add up all the lost aircraft and equipment it would be extremely large. My message to SM, stop giving it lip service and FIX THE PROBLEM.
Old 08-15-2010, 10:28 AM
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Default RE: Dragon wing failure.

The same tab separated on my SM F-16. Had to punch a hole in the wing to retrieve it back because it fell into the wing.

This is BS.
Old 08-15-2010, 10:44 AM
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Default RE: Dragon wing failure.

Hey Jim,

Can you turn it into a clock and hang it on the wall? Ah it probably would'nt keep time anyway. An expensive wall piece though.

Doane
Old 08-15-2010, 11:10 AM
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Default RE: Dragon wing failure.

What really makes me mad about this is that Anton has know about this for a LONG time. He is going to have his "staff check the kits".....give me a break. I am not a victim of this poor design but know many that have been. I was going to buy another SM kit this Fall....not until I see solid evidence that SM is responding to this problem with a REAL fix and pics to support it. Call it a boycott of at least one.

Old 08-15-2010, 11:54 AM
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Default RE: Dragon wing failure.

Hey Doane,

I think the wings might fall off when it is 3 o'clock and 9 o'clock!

I'm trying to figure out how to check/beef up the aluminum tabs. I never thought about it but Albert is right. The tabs are only about 3/4 if of an inch long in the wing. That's just crazy!

Jim
Old 08-15-2010, 12:17 PM
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Default RE: Dragon wing failure.

I'll tell you what guys, I've been considering buying a SM small F86 but not now!
Old 08-15-2010, 01:05 PM
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Default RE: Dragon wing failure.

Holy crap. with all the bad publicity FEJ has gotten.. then Jet Legend.... and now Skymaster.. hell i'm never buying a chinese Arf. I'll stick with the more expensive US and European made stuff. I work waayyyyy to hard for my money to put it into a company that has known of issues with MULTIPLE planes and still uses the same crappy technique. what-ever happened to a bolt going through the fuselage and into a blind-nut in the wing root, or a bolt through the wing into the wing tube?

next question. Is that Hot-melt glue holding the tab in?
Old 08-15-2010, 01:36 PM
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Default RE: Dragon wing failure.

I was standing next to my friend who was flying his Large SM viper. He had a total of 4 flights on it. On a normal pass the wing pulled out and the plane crashed and burned. New JC 160, new JR servos, everything new. Nothing left but the wing that pulled away from the fuse.

We picked up the wing and guess what? The little metal tab that plugs into the fuse was missing. The tab had seperated from the wing as in your pictures. $!2,000 dollars down the tube. I took a picture of the wing and sent it to jeff who forwarded it to Anton. They are sending him a new kit, but refused to pay for his new 4000 dollar engine loss and other items when it was clearly their fault.

Another friend has the kit also and will be reinforcing the tab somehow.

Stan
Old 08-15-2010, 01:49 PM
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Default RE: Dragon wing failure.

Albert,

Having looked at how your wing mounting tab was secured, I thought I'd examine the wing of my crashed Dragon. The attached pictures are the results. I wonder if this was one of the ones they "checked" after being informed there was a issue.

I really see no way of fixing this correctly on wings that are built and painted. The attachment method of the mounting tab to the wing skin is less than adequate in my opinion. There is a gap between the aluminum tab and "balsa" wing skin of about 1/4"............as you can see in the pic, they just "kind of" filled the area with some adhesive foreign to me. To be honest, looks like something my sister would do.

John
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Old 08-15-2010, 02:08 PM
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Default RE: Dragon wing failure.


ORIGINAL: invertmast

Holy crap. with all the bad publicity FEJ has gotten.. then Jet Legend.... and now Skymaster..
In my opinion, the cat is out of the bag now. There have been a lot of people with SM issues but have been afraid of coming out of the closet out of fear of not being able to get repalcement parts or service from SM and SM dealers. Not just the lower end stuff like this, but the bigger models as well. Of course, the more expensive the model, the more likely that the costumer will get "better" service.

The picture above, is a picture of crap. It needs to be added to Wikepedia. All that white glue is supposed to hold a wing from detaching in flight? Scary stuff! What I don't understand is how somebody like BVM would deal this POS!!
What about the people who gave up waiting on parts, or who had to wait for months? What kind of %hit is this?

From seing SM and FEJ I see a lot in common. The only difference I can tell is that SM has better air systems. It seems like they use that white hot glue in lieu of propper structural reinforcement.

Again, like somebody said earlier, it is just a matter of making small changes to teh design that would go a long way, and take care of those who lost a model and/or equipment to make it right.
We need to put a stop to this customer mistreatment once and for all.

David
Old 08-15-2010, 02:10 PM
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Default RE: Dragon wing failure.


ORIGINAL: jthomas235

Albert,

Having looked at how your wing mounting tab was secured, I thought I'd examine the wing of my crashed Dragon. The attached pictures are the results. I wonder if this was one of the ones they "checked" after being informed there was a issue.

I really see no way of fixing this correctly on wings that are built and painted. The attachment method of the mounting tab to the wing skin is less than adequate in my opinion. There is a gap between the aluminum tab and "balsa" wing skin of about 1/4"............as you can see in the pic, they just "kind of" filled the area with some adhesive foreign to me. To be honest, looks like something my sister would do.

John
Wow, just wow. I don't know how you guys stay so calm in the face of this obvious flaw in these planes. If it was me I'd be on a plane to Taiwan the next day looking for a little something more than "we'll check into it". Even if the tab was properly attached, just being attached to the wing skin is not a secure connection.

Old 08-15-2010, 02:16 PM
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Default RE: Dragon wing failure.

ORIGINAL: racer8297

Hey Doane,

I think the wings might fall off when it is 3 o'clock and 9 o'clock!

I'm trying to figure out how to check/beef up the aluminum tabs. I never thought about it but Albert is right. The tabs are only about 3/4 if of an inch long in the wing. That's just crazy!

Jim
Racer. Clean up that glue crap they put in there and fashion/glue a hardwood block that connets the root rib and sheeting. Then screw and glue the tap back in!! Will never move.
Old 08-15-2010, 02:19 PM
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Default RE: Dragon wing failure.

Here is one of the pictures of my friends Viper wing showing the missing metal tab which holds the wing on. Quite evident the tab pulled out of the wing. This after 4 flights.

Stan

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Old 08-15-2010, 02:20 PM
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Default RE: Dragon wing failure.

The tabs were a concern since day one but all I can do is pull on them before flying to make sure they were not loose. I thought they were several inces long and perhaps went through a few ribs. Had I known they were that short and glued with gum I would have never flown it.

Albert
Old 08-15-2010, 02:24 PM
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Default RE: Dragon wing failure.

Jim,

We talked about making sure it doesn't happen to yours and about coming up with a solution. Well I'll open up one of the wings so we can better understand what's in there and perhaps come up with a game plan. Hey I don't cut holes into a wing for just anybody buddy. lol


Albert

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