Zeque Build Glow Powered

Why not put the elevator servos in the tail?

Last summer I assembled (one doesn't build an ARF) a CHP Scandalous. Chip gave me all of the answers to the test including which servos and where to put them. Did I follow the advice of THE expert? No, I had a better idea which was to put the Futaba 9650's in the tail rather than under the rudder servo under the canopy. Did my solution work? Yes and no. It was simple and solid AND required a 6 ounce battery behind the firewall to balance properly which put me about 5 ounces over eleven pounds. Great if I was flying IMAC.

Rusty's toy airplane rule #13: If the designer or former F3A world champion returns your calls, let alone tells you what, how, where something goes (airplane parts), say thank you and do it.


Weights of stuff and comparisons:

(2) Futaba 9650's weigh exactly the same as (1) Futaba 9151 , about 1.8 ounces.
The Futaba 40" HD servo extensions weigh exactly the same as the Central Hobbies D.E.P.'s un-cut pushrod kit w/ (2) 36" 1/4 square balsa sticks.
Put 1.8 ounces 52" behind the CG versus 8" and you discover my problem.
Temperature may effect any pushrod 50" long.
Geometry, electronic set-up (sub trim), wear and tear may effect servo matching over time.

Everything is a compromise and I try to be realistic about my interest and abilities to muddle through them. Troy will do a fine job installing the DEPS and I will have more time to work on other stuff.

Rusty Dose
Team Futaba
Team YS Performance

Ah Ha!

Just read Rusty's post again he was trying to trick and confuse me and succeeded, not nearly as hard as it used to be. That stab pictured with the two servos is indeed a Beryll stab. Rusty says something about playing with a new camera, but I really think he was just trying to trick us.

Rusty I did the same. Chip told me run the serno in the fuse under the rudder, did i listen No. I ended up having to run a 6 ounce battery behind the firewall just like you did Plnae ended up weighing 10lbs 8oz. On a brighter note I just switched from ES pipe to the new Shorter Hatori pipe and I had to move my battery several inches back from the firewall because the shorter pipe moved the CG forward.

I plan to place the servos(2-JR3421sa) in the stab of mine, I also plan to use the short hatori pipe(821) on a YS160. Just wondering how much this may throw off the CG compared to a MK system or DEPs system? If significantly different I may reconsider...

Doc

Zeque Build Glow Powered

Doc's (a very funny guy...especially with Frank D.) post regarding servos in the tail.

The weights I mentioned a few posts "up" pretty well define the components...basically the same total weight. The challenge is "where" the weight is located. I will be using the same Hatori header/muffler combination and based on the layout of Mr. Suzuki's model with the battery and rx in the fuse behind the tank. I assume you will be tail heavy. Some pilots like how that flies and feels. Personally, I do not. The plane can handle a big a#$%& battery in the front, but you probably did not invest in THIS model to have to resort to that requirement...

Rusty Dose
Team Futaba
Team YS Performance

The difference in CG location between a single elevator servo mounted near the wing verses two elevator servos in the stab is huge. I had a plane that started off with dual elevator servos in the tail, and it was tail heavy by about one inch, or 8 ounces of lead in the nose. I replaced that setup with DEPS, removed the lead, and the cg shifted forward about 1.25 inches. It is an easy decision -- install everything but the elevator setup. Then just figure out what it takes to balance on the CG without adding ballast.

In my experience, most glow pattern planes (even with a YS) will be tail heavy with dual elevator servos in the stab. The short pipe won't offset the CG significantly.

Doc,

the Zeque was designed with the Short Hatori pipe and a single servo up front. SO you WILL be tail heavy if you stick them in the back.

Just for comparison on my Astral XXc I put everything in the model the same as Naruke did, even used a Nimh battery 2300mah. The models CG is perfect just that way. Its right at the suggested range nothing added and nothing needed.

Model is 10lbs all up 4536g currently has the 170DZ in it with a solid BP spinner. I don't see the need to change anything about it. By the way I installed the DEPS system in it.

Troy

Rusty, that was pretty funny. Have you posted the otherr twelve rules? 8-)

Zeque Build Glow Powered

Regarding Rusty's attempt to maintain thread "hits" absent any "actual" building...

Life's experiences have provided me a collection of rules which, like rule #13, have been developed to protect me from "me". Better stated, the disease of "Me" which I have stolen from a book on management by basketball coach Pat Riley. I encourage you to read the book or at least the chapter.

Rusty's toy airplane rule #4: Invest as much time in selecting your (sweet heart, spouse, someone you like or someone you think you like) valentine's day card as you did the last pair of toy airplane wheels.

Seriously, the Zeque WILL be ready to fly by Sunday evening (2/11)! In the coming days, I will post the following items which I feel are of potential interest including:

Dave Guerin's super slick way to mount wheel pants.
The Hatori 821 pipe set-up with all the probably way too expensive and not completely needed BUT are very cool hardware.
The "Bob Kohler" signature model stand.


Rusty Dose
Team Futaba
Team YS Performance

Zeque Build Glow Powered

As previously mentioned, I have always marveled at the Japanese model stands. Bryan Hebert had a nifty stand for his Quest. My pal Bob Kohler, who is in my mind a "master" wood worker volunteered to build me a custom stand for the Zeque. Bob came over the other evening, reviewed my scribbles, gathered the Home Depot materials and returned yesterday with the results. He has already decided to build another "really" cool one to out do the example on the Oxai-Zeque home page.

The rubber molding is from BVM Models and enough to complete this stand was $15.00. It has a mind of it's own and required alot of verbal coaxing to get it to look pretty good. One Central Hobbies servo screw is placed on each end and tightened to pull just under the surface. A couple coats of MinWax clear urethane, quick scratch of 400 sand paper and a coat of SC Johnson paste wax to finish it off.

The stand is symmetrical and will make the model much easier to transport and wrench on at the field or at home Thank you Bob!


Rusty Dose
Team Futaba
Team YS Performance

Zeque Build Glow Powered

Tail wheel. The tail wheel I want to use is still in route via Adrian Wong and one of his contacts in Hong Kong. The proven and clearly still way over the top...the MK tail wheel on a diet. Cameron Smith, 2006 NATS second place finisher in Masters, sent me a photo of his modified tail wheel a few weeks ago. I just drilled a few holes using a UNI-BIT with a 3/32 pilot hole for alignment.

The scale shows the completed weight, maybe someone will post the "stock" weight.


Rusty Dose
Team Futaba
Team YS Performance

Zeque Build Glow Powered

The parts and pieces for the next steps including the battery and receiver mounting plate picured below. I like to use "craft plywood" available at craft stores (crazy considering the name...) for non-strength related parts but hard balsa is just not strong enough.

Velcro straps available at Home Depot, are used to strap the battery and rx in place over foam rubber available from SIG. The natural foam rubber, white in color, is heavier but makes me feel more comfortable. I just cut a piece of 1/4" to 3/8" slightly larger than the component, placed between the straps. Simple and easy to remove or make adjustments. (I will be able to charge the 1320 mah lipo pack outside the model or exchange with a spare.)

The slot for the velcro is cut with a tiny all purpose bit in the trusty, but indespensible lithium Dremel tool. I showed the picture because sometimes I read stuff and still can't figure out how something was done. A 1" forstner bit makes quick work of the lightening hole. 220 grit sandpaper cleans the piece up prior to installation with "green" label ZAP.


Rusty Dose
Team Futaba
Team YS Performance

Zeque Build Glow Powered

The wheel pants and landing gear. Wheel pants have given me fits for years until Dave Guerin's visit to my home a few years ago. The following is Dave's method which may include the use of other smart modeler's ideas.

The Zeque parts in the photo includes the landing gear mounting components which ARE unique to this model. To mount wheel pants you need to cut (4) 3/4" craft plywood squares, (2) Harry Higley 5/32" long axles. You will need a drill press, 5/32 drill bit, a UNI-BIT 120 grit sandpaper, a 10" bubble level, a bench clamp and less than an hour.

First find the center of the wheel pant opening. Second, determine where or you want to locate the center of the axle from the bottom of the pant. I generally put the center about 1/2" - 5/8" from the bottom.



Rusty Dose
Team Futaba
Team YS Performance

Zeque Build Glow Powered

Installing wheel pants continued...The method has the axle stick through to the other side which helps the pants stay aligned and in better shape on grass fields or a really rough landing. To save time (my time) I have taken the liberty to include photos of a FOCUS II wheel pant intallation. I will be happy to post the Zeque stuff later.

Step 1: Using the 120 grit sandpaper, sand the inside of the wheel pants at the location of the 1/8 x 3/4 x 3/4 craft plywood plates.
Step 2: Trial fit the plates taking the time to contour the edges to fit in the pant. The more surface contact you have the less glue and stronger the bond will be. One plate goes on each side of the pant (inside!!!) Glue with green ZAP.
Step 3: You double checked the location of the axle?
Step 4: Put a sharp 5/32 drill bit in a drill press. ( I use a $99 special purchased years ago with success.)
Step 5: Get some scrap wood and stuff it into the wheel opening. You are going to drill a hole from one side of the pant THROUGH to the other side and you do not want to crush the pant in the process.
Step 6: Before drilling, make sure you are parallell to the drill press table.
Step 7: Drill hole slowly!!
Step 8: Determine a left and a right wheel pant.
Step 9: Using a UNI-BIT (any stepped drill bit will do, the stepped drills cut rather than tear holes) open up the inside of each pant to about 5/16" to fit over the Harry Higley nut.
Step 10: You used a drill press to drill a 5/32" hole in the landing gear for the axle!
Step 11: Clamp the landing gear leg on the bench as shown.
Step 12: Using a level, level the wheel pant with the bench.
Step 13: Use a drill bit to drill through the landing gear leg through the wheel pant for the anti-rotation screw. I use a 4-4- screw with a nylon washer into a 4-40 blind nut.
Step 14: Mark about 1/16 - 3/32" of the axle to stick out of the wheel pant and cut-off with a Dremel cut-off wheel.
Step 15: Enlarge the hole you jsut drilled in the wheel pant for a 4-40 blind nut and you are done!


Rusty Dose
Team Futaba
Team YS Performance

Zeque Build Glow Powered

Landing Gear leg installation. Mr. Suzuki used some kind of a plate to sandwich the landing gear legs. I am going to use a 1/16" aircraft plywood plate covered with a heavey carbon fiber cloth using epoxy. The plate will be made, holes drilled and then cover the plate with the cloth. See first the first post of this build for the themes I am trying to execute.

You will notice a funky drill bit and some little plywood donuts, aluminum washers and some very heavy 6-32 socket screws. The aluminum washers are "extas" from the MK control horns used for the rudder and elevator horns which are drilled out with a #27 drill for the 6-32 socket screws. Micro fasteners no longer stocks the 6-32 x 1" aluminum...

The funky drill bit is a "plug" cutting drill bit. ($14.95 at any fully stocked hardware store, not Home Depot.) The donuts will hold the 6-32 blind nuts to provide additional support for the nuts.

The Zeque landing gear fit perfectly (actually one would expect nothing less) and I will put painters tape, measure, check, measure and fiddle before I drill anything. I WILL clamp the plywood plate and drill throught the plate and landing gear in one step.


Rusty Dose
Team Futaba
Team YS Performance

Zeque Build Glow Powered

The rudder cables...I imagine there are no less than 1000 ideas and preferences to complete this. My solution uses a pretty long rudder horn (MK medium aluminum control horns), steel rudder cables (Todd Blose, BP Hobbies, makes an excellent kit with Kevlar cord), 2-56 ball bearing ends on the servo and Klett steel pinned clevis at the rudder end.

The Zeque already has the hole for the horn drilled. The MK horns do not come with what you need to make a rudder horn...a metric threaded rod capable of being long enough to go through the very wide rudders and the horns. I happen to have all of the parts from a Composite ARF Yak 2.6 (also very cool) which has threaded rod for pushrods (maybe 2.5mm?.)

The challenge is that the horns do not fit against the rudder so I use the Loctite 9462 glue (available at BVM Models very expensive or McMaster Carr mail order for less than $25 with reusable gun) to smear on the horn prior to installation, install it, then smear more glue on the other horn and screw them together tight. You are left with glue oozing out which can be wipped away with wax and grease remover leaving a perfect little "filet" on the rear portion of the horn. Very strong, looks custom and is simple.

I use the Proctor metal "cable swage" to crimp the cable, with 2-26 screw eyes for the clevis or ball end. Simple, smooth and precise.
The Zeque has plastic sleeves installed for the rudder cables. Total installation time less than one hour. The Futaba 9155 is lightning fast and is a stump puller, very important for crisp snaps and rudder authority.


Rusty Dose
Team Futaba
Team YS Performance

Rusty:
The stock MK tail wheel is 13 gms.
Nice build thread.
Stuart Chale

Bling Bling... [8D]

Zeque Build Glow Powered

Rudder control system continued...The photos show the Loctite adhesive liberally applied to control horn. Horn with threaded rod attached is pushed into snug hole and adhesive is applied to other horn. The glue is clearly oozing out and the chemical to remove is in the photo as well. Clean-up and you have a completed installation of the horns.

I like to copy interesting ideas and share the source if I can remember where or who is the source. You will notice (2) colors of heat shrink tubing covering the rudder cable clevis, 2-56 eye-bolt and swage. I saw this on the Oxai-Beryll site from the example of a Swiss pilots model...I suppose it makes it more reliable...I really enhances the "coolness"...or "sweet" for my more sophomoric readers.

I wonder who did the graphics?


Rusty Dose
Team Futaba
Team YS Performance

Zeque Build Glow Powered

Rudder control system continued...The interior of the fuselage features a plywood tray which is pre-cut for servos, battery and rx, switch, special K& S tank and throttle servo. Please note that the elevator servo is patiently waiting for the Troy Newman DEPS elevator system (as in premier installer, not the originator although he may be...) which will be installed by Troy next week in Phoenix.

I almost forgot to fuel proof the inside. I use the Z-Poxy finishing epoxy with K&B superpoxy thinner (very hard to find) to about (1) part of A and B to (2) parts of thinner mixed in (1) ounce plastic cups. Epoxy brushes are available at Home Depot but do not get them in the "paint" section because they are twice as much than if you go to the "plumbing" section.

I remember the first YS installation in a Godfrey Custom built Lazer in 1988. In my excitement to fly it, I lost track of the fact that I had pumped about 1/2 gallon of fuel into the fuselage! I noticed it coming out of the tail. Yes, fuel proofing is always a good idea.

Rusty's toy airplane rule #7: Only fuel proof airplanes that you want to keep.

The battery/rx tray is installed with the straps and material has been removed from the tray in front of the receiver for the servo wires.

Rusty's toy airplane rule #11: Servo wires will find every sharp corner of your model and demonstrate the results at the least convenient opportunity.

Large fuel tubing, cut in half, is pushed onto the tray to prevent rule #11.

Discussion about investing in fuel proofing: Troy took the model home from the Sun Valley Flyers Field on Monday or Tuesday evening 2/19...Wednesday evening Arch Stafford began staying with Troy. Thursday moring they gave me a TON of (##&^*&) about my excessive use of epoxy to fuel proof the model...I said it didn't add 1/2 an ounce...well the final weight ended up to be 9 pounds 14.5 - 15 ounces...


Rusty Dose
Team Futaba
Team YS Performance

Zeque Build Glow Powered

The switch. Yes, most of my installation techniques are designed to "prevent" losing a model due to a mechanical or sytem failure. Flying them into the ground is okay. My enjoyment of flying can also be traced back to my confidence in the motor, airframe and control system reliability.

Readers of this thread may remember that all of the parts have been posted. I like the Jaccio switch which is "on" if the switch fails. I also have have many fond memories of Mr. Oddino's (Mr. Jaccio) columns in Radio Control Modeler. Specifically, the 6.0 volt version. The Zeque has a place for the switch but I am not aware of any $200 Japanese little doo dah to make turn on and off so I reflected on the Wickizer's tail wheel in an earlier post. The parts include a Dubro 1/16 wheel collar, remote switch mount bolt, Tettra off-set rod end and threaded rod, 2-56 bolt from a ball end kit (Dubro).

The white stuff on the back of the iside bolt is litium grease for reducing vibration from fuselage.


Rusty Dose
Team Futaba
Team YS Performance

Zeque Build Glow Powered

The fuel system. The Zeque is designed to use 1/8" aluminum tubing to run the fuel lines ftom the fuel tank to the engine compartment. There are laser cut holes for (2) tubes. The photo shows one tube with a 90 degree bend which will connect to the clunk line and the straight tube is for the vent. The holes lined up perfectly. Green Zap was used on the front and rear holes to secure.

The tubing was cut with a razor blade while "rolling" on the work bench. An xacto #11 blade cleans up the inside of the tube and 220 followed by 400 smooths the outside.

Rusty's toy airplane rule #8: When diagnosing an engine problem, the easy to reach fuel line is discovered to be the problem only after the engine and tank have been completely removed and disassembled.


Rusty Dose
Team Futaba
Team YS Performance

Zeque Build Glow Powered

Landing gear installation. As a reminder, my goal is to execute the themes used by Mr. Suzuki, Zeque designer. The landing gear mounting uses a carbon plate with (4) bolts and washers. I will use washers from the MK medium control horns drilled out for a 6-32 body drill #27.

I made the plate from 1/16 aircraft plywood, cut to size and the holes drilled for the bolts. Carbon fiber cloth is then bonded to one side using 30 minute ZAP epoxy then turned face down on a piece of wax paper. The other side is coated with ZAP laminating epoxy and another sheet of wax paper is placed on the plate. A weight is added to the top of the plate until cured.

The completed plate has a very smooth finish and is now very strong. The plate is trimmed, the edges sanded and ZAP laminating epoxy is brushed on the edges for installation.


Rusty Dose
Team Futaba
Team YS Performance

Zeque Buil GLow Powered

Fuel system continued. The Zeque is designed to use a K&S fuel tank. A nifty unit which has a rubber stopper, screw-on cap and a molded in vent at the top of the tank into a bubble or bulge allowing the tank to be completely filled.

The tank tray has (2) laser cut slots to use a very thin carbon fiber band (Lone Star Balsa, 4" x 36" .000? $10.00) to hold the rear of the tank. The front of the tank is captured by a balsa bulkhead which also supports the throttle servo. The aluminum tank fitting, special foam clunk (YS Performance or Central Hobbies) using the supplied thin walled very flexible fuel tubing is assembled in a few minutes.

Silicone is added to the front of the tank support opening and the balsa former, fuel tubing is pre-cut and installed using an additional band of large fuel tubing to prevent from coming off and installed. The carbon band is wrapped around the tank and secured with black "speed" tape (duct tape, Home Depot). Gorgeous, light, easily removed and strong.

Well, it did look very cool...

After the firstt flight the model was disassembled, checked over and reassembled. ALL OK. After the fourth flight the tank was loose and the teeny, tiny little pieces of plywood holding the 10,000,000 pound tensil strength carbon fiber band broke (both) like the tooth picks they were/are. I drilled a small hole about 3/8' from the center of each slot and used (2) nylon tie wraps to hold the rear of the tank. Added a little more silicon to the front and belly tank mount and it has survived (5) additional flights.


Rusty Dose
Team Futaba
Team YS Performance

Zeque Build Glow Powered

Radio installation is basically complete. A tidy installation looks better, is more reliable and allows you to recognioze if something is out of place. Loose wires are "speed" taped to the fuselage side, wire ties are added and the Jaccio 6.0 voltage regulator is attached using velcor sticky backed strips. The power connector is captured in the velcro for added saftey.

Rusty Dose
Team Futaba
Team YS Performance