My ESC is as far forward as the BEC connection will allow, this puts the ESC in front of the battery which is snug up against the wing tube, so the ESC gets the airflow first, I suspect this is a problem with the TP5000 and not with the FP3700 as I am using FP4350's without any problem.

Mike

I mounted mine on the bottom of the motor box with a zip tie. The ESC gets direct air flow from the opening in the cowl :-)

Hi
I have got my Angel together and I tried balancing it tonight. I has the standard motor ESC set up and TP 3875mAH pack on board as far back as I can get it . I cant seem to get the thing to balance at the recommended point of 145 mm back from the leading edge. This is my first mid wing type plane and I am trying to balance it upright. What if anything am I doing wrong?

Mike

Ps I agree with everything that has been said about this plane. It has been an absolute pleasure to build and is the best ARTF I have ever assembled. If this plane flies half as good as it is reported to do I will be getting it's bigger brother ( Wind 110) over the winter.

Hi
Just tried it inverted and it didnt make a wit of difference the bird is still coming out nose heavy. Before i clad the tail in half a church roof does any else have the same problem?

Mike

PS 145 mm back from the leading edge does look awefully far back. By eye way further back than the 1/3 MAC

My personal opinion and experience is that if you want a plane for flying sequences the 5S setup is the best way to go. That means not using the recommended motor and battery. From what I have gathered everyone who has a 5S setup likes what they got. I have a 6 lb all up plane and that is using 5S 5350ma packs and a separate 910ma Lipo and voltage regulator for the receiver. I fly 8-9 minute flights. The plane flys an effortless AMA Masters sequence. Prop is a 15X8 APC and if memory serves me , I was only drawing 60 amps. A little over 1000W. I've got 42 flights on it so far and really like it. It is the smallest plane I have ever flown that comes amazingly close in feel to a 2M ship. Except in high winds of course<g> The plane lands so nicely. No stressing of landing gear at this weight.

I am using the Extreme Flight Torque 4014T 570 electric motor that I had experience with on a 6lb - 5 oz Extreme Flight Extra 300. The Torque motor only needs about a 5/8" offset and uses the same mounting holes already on the firewall. I get a double bonus here since I can use the same packs I use in my 2M ship. Controller is the 85A Castle Creations controller. I'm using JR8311's on rudder and elevator and JR3421SA's on aileron. What the manufacturer recommends is not necessarily the best setup for everyone.

Just as an aside I just picked up two TRueRC 5000ma 5S packs at $110 a piece which is a lot cheaper than the packs I use for my 2M ship. It will be interesting to see how these packs hold up.

PS - There is no CG issue with the setup I am using.

Mike Hanner

My C of G is 145mm back from the LE of the wing at the root it seems to be ideal, this was how it all worked out, no church roof required or any movement of servo's or Rx it just worked out perfectly as assembled.

J Lachowski

Using a 5S 5350Mah pack against my 6S 4350Mah pack will possibly be the same all up weight, if you are using TP batteries yours will be heavier. I put these with a 4S pack to use in my 2.1M Composite ARF Extra.

Contrary to popular belief a heavier plane will grove through the manouvres better than a light one, but what you do need is light wings to stop inertia from taking rolling manouvres to far, but as you say each plane is a subjective thing what works for one person is not necceseraly what another person wants, I can't fault my set up with the 6S and the AXI 4130/16 on a 16 x10 gives me 9 mins of hard flying, using DS821's all around. Just another opinion.

Mike

Before you clad it in church roof, what servo do you have in the rear for the elevator, maybe change it for a metal geared digital, mind you I don't know why yours is comming out nose heavy, you do have an electric prop on it and not an IC one don't you? stupid question I know.

145 back from the LE is only just inside the tip if you take into account the sweep back of the wing, so there is an awfull lot of wing behind the C of G I have not done any calculations, but I bet its somwhere close between 25% and 30% MAC. Put your wing tube into one wing and sight along it that will give a good indication of the proportion of wing behind the C of G.

Mike

Hi Mike . .

I am amazed you can't get the CG. I am using a 5S 3700mAh pack which weighs about 470g and the back of the pack sits right where the inner engine box / doubler finishes. The pack is basically half into the cowl and half back into the canopy/hatch area. I fit a 650mAh LiPo flight pack between the 5S and the wing tube with "daylight" each side !

Did you use the standard spinner? A heavier after-market spinner could cause issues.

Mike, what is the weight of your pack?

PS. The plane is a JOY to fly. I have flown a few 50 and 90 size planes and this is better than any of them. Order the WIND 110E with confidence.

Cheers, JB

Jeff

If you mean me, my FlightPower 4350Mah's weigh in at 655grams with 4mm bullit conectors and full length velcro on the underside, positioned hard against the wing tube they are perfect.

I have a Flair Swallow, Jamara Javelin and a Graupner Extra all supposedly F3A machines and with out doubt the Angel fly's better than all of them, the only things better are my 2M and over composites, but then we are talking about £2000.00 plus aircraft and having to compare it to those is saying an awfull lot about this wonderfull plane.

The only problem is getting hold of a spare canopy, every one they send is in a worse condition than the one I wish to replace, would you belive they sent the last one in bubble wrap only through the post, what where they thinking of.

Mike J

Hi
Problem solved. This TULIP cant measure 145mm.

Test flight will be on the first available weekend or evening.

Mike

Sorry . . don't quite get it. How did you solve the problem. (very interested )

JB

LOL [sm=red_smile.gif]

Mike

Ohhhhh . . Geeez . . . I'm slow [][sm=red_smile.gif]

That's all right Jeff we know it gets to all of us in the end, short term memory loss and all that.

Mike

I received my plane on Tuesday from Fedon Aircraft. This is a very nice plane. I am using a Hacker A50 12s with 5s 4600 TP batteries and Jeti opto plus 70 amp esc. For servos I went with some JR 8231's that I had in a drawer.

The plane really went together fast. I skipped their ez connectors that go on the servo linkage and just with with an EZ link with an L bend, no slop and simple. I had to move the battery about 2" forward to hit the recomended cg. My plane came out at 5lb 12 oz with the 20oz battery. I am happy with that. It was 72oz without the battery.

The only fix that the plane needed was on the wings. The right wing moves up and down 1/8", easy fix.

I just got back from its first flights. The plane is going to need some right thrust. Trim required with 145cg, 8 clicks of up. a couple of clicks of left aileron. KE was slightly going to the canopy, might be because of all the up trim with this cg, no roll coupling. I will put a few more flights with different cg settings before I do any changes or mixes to the plane.

The power with the 13-10 prop was 1100 watts(60amps), this is enough for a good upline but it is not overpowered. The batteries are new so I only flew 5 minutes on each. Temp on the battery was 120, motor 128, ambient 91. I think these numbers are good for Arizona. I set a time for full throttle only and a normal timer on my 12Z. In the five minute flight I spent 1 min 40sec above 80% throttle.

It is not a 2m plane but it was alot of fun to fly.

quitst

I havn't had to touch mine in any way other than the above, not even any trim on the Tx when first flown, using a 16x10 on the AXI the built in side thrust is absolutly spot on, with the battery pushed all the way back to the wing tube the inverted is hands off, and knife edge is also hands off using the 6% mix as advised in the manual, you are obviously using a seperate Rx battery can you move that around to get the C of G a bit further back?

As I am using 6S I am nearer 1400watts which may make a difference, your temps sound high to me, but then I live in the UK and the ambient is a bit lower [sm=cry_smile.gif], its a wonderful plane to practice with and I would not be without mine, I will put my "Medusa Orcle" on her next time out and report back the findings.

Mike

Mike

I have an oracle also, maybe I should use it. I have plenty of room to move my batteries back, I can go back 50mm to the tube. I was just noting that the recommended cg created the need for up trim, about 2mm, not alot.
I am not running a rx battery. I have a UBEC.

I also need to get a prop selection. I would like to try something like a 14-8. Just to see if it pulls harder on an upline. I do like the pitch speed of the 13-10 but it may be hurting me on the uplines.

After chargeing my batteries last night I noticed that I only used 1800 mah in the 5 minute flight.

Now that will be interesting to compare the two results, from the same plane with different set ups, look forward to seeing your results, I may have to do mine static as the weather has taken a turn for the worse at the moment.

Mike

Yesterday I move the batteries back a little each flight. I am not all the way back to the tube. It still requires down elevator while inverted but not as much, It removed half of my elevator up trim. I will get some more time on my this morning.

Last weekend I tried an apc 14-8.5 prop. Amp draw was low and so was the power. Then I tried a 15-8 apc, this is the ticket. I am not sure how many amps I am pulling. Now with good power management I am getting 9 minutes of unlimited flying and I am spending less then 50 seconds above 80% throttle. My battery and motor temps are nearing 140 degrees, but it was 104 ambient.

I was ready to give up with this plane, it flies great but I hate 5 minute flights. This 15-8 prop has given me the motivation to dial the plane in. I had quite a bit of aileron trim. One tip was +2, one was -2 and the root of the wings was +.2 degrees. I twisted the wing back to +.2 at the tips and now I have removed the aileron trim.
I put in one washer of right thrust, it needs more. For now I have put in a throttle to rudder mix.
I also put in a down line mix on 1.5%
Still no mix for KE flight.[X(]
I am shocked how easy this plane does rolling circle and loops. Also, 40 size planes should not snap this good, both positive and neg.

I now have 20 flights on the plane, no loose parts, no bad glue joints, and the canopy is still tight.

Hi All,
I just test flew my Angel..What an immense model!
I'm running the standard/recommended motor, APC 16x10E, ESC and a 6s Flightpower EVOLITE V2, 4270Mah battery. 8.30 minutes flying time.
Strange thing i notice despite Knife edge being almost perfect and the c of g at (or very near where its supposed to be ..145mm or on the fuselage cross brace).. i need to hold a little down elevator in inverted flight..Does anyone else have this?
The model also pulls slightly to the left on uplines... I have since found the lateral balance on my model was very left wing heavy..so put 7 grams of lead in the right hand wing, just need some nice weather to get more flights in.
I fly all the straight and level stuff at half power but find the throttle "not as linear" as a YS powered ship, i don't know maybe it is just the motor is so quiet and only audible at 2/3 power upwards...Has anyone else noticed this? I flew a friends Angel and it was exactly the same.
I also found the model to fly at a very constant airspeed also both in up and down lines.
Another oddity is of the two EVOLITE packs i have..One pack weighs 650 grams the other 620grams? Maybe the electrons in one pack are heavier than the others electrons!!!!!
It was nice taking just a model, TX and batteries in the TX case to the field, no fuel, starting equipment or cleaning wrags!

best wishes
Dave

Dave

I put an expo curve on my throttle to make it more linear, steeper at the bottom (opposite to say elevator) this seems to bring the power in quicker more like a IC powered plane, I don't neccesarly see this as a fault, just that we are all used to IC and flying electric for patten is just different.

On the FlightPower packs, why is it when you buy four packs all the same the cables come out in different places, some on the same side some on different sides, some with both wires at the bottom of the pack and others with them one top one bottom, it would be nice if they where consistant then you could shorten them to suit your installation and tidy everything up.

Mike

I had to add a few clicks of up trim with the cg. I also have no mix for a straight KE flight. I have to use down elevator for inverted flight, but I would say normal for a pattern ship. If it wasn't for the up trim I would have a straight downline, but then I would need a KE mix, oh well.

It is good to see that everyone with this plane is having a good experience. I wish they could make an inexpensive 2m plane with all would construction.

Tony,

Looks like Fliton is making an all wood version of the Element 170 that will go for about $600. According to them it will be available in August.

Hi Quist,
[quote]ORIGINAL: quist
I had to add a few clicks of up trim with the cg. Ditto here too! I needed two or three clicks up trim and three clicks left trim.
(I also have no mix for a straight KE flight.
I have 6% up elevator as per Sebo's instructions and it's perfect.. if i'm being an absolute perfectionist it could do with 1% or 2% of opposite aileron to rudder mix as well.)
I have to use down elevator for inverted flight, but I would say normal for a pattern ship. (mmh depends which 2m bird and setup you compare to?)
If it wasn't for the up trim I would have a straight downline, but then I would need a KE mix, oh well. (I have not got this far yet ,only two test flights.)

It is good to see that everyone with this plane is having a good experience. I wish they could make an inexpensive 2m plane with all would construction.
Which begs the question why did Sebart design a Wind 110 as the next model? surely an Angel S140/160 or Wind S140/160 would have been a better bet?
Has anyone else added weight to one wing tip to sort out wing lateral imbalance? If so how much weight did you need?
brgds
Dave