Take a look, still not a good choice IMO.

Note: Make sure after clicking on the picture to view it you then click the little icon on the bottom right of the picture that says "Expand to actual size"...

Jack

I have found that Motorcalc is not that accurate, gives a good guide line, but not a diffinitive indication. I use an AXI 4130/16 in my Angel and it pulls with authority, I don't have Motorcalc on this PC so can't say what it makes of the AXI on a 16x10 with 6S, would be intersting to know?

Mike

Jack,
I decided to take your advice and went ahead and ordered the Hacker motor....I recieved the Angel ( blue version) yesterday and the quality is very impressive. The covering is flawless without a single wrinkle and it all looks perfect. I can't wait to get this beauty up and flying. I plan to set it up and use it strickly for pattern practice and no 3D. I have other planes to do the flip-flop stuff with. Anyway, thanks for your help....RS

Russmall, I had the Hacker A50-16S in my Angel 50s. I was running it with a cc hv85 , apc 16/10 prop and tpx 5000 6s batts. All I could get was about 1000watts. Not enough for me! I now have a Scorpion 4025-12 in the Angel. Hope you fare better with your setup!
I agree with Mike on the motorcalc numbers not being accurate. I also have a Axi 4130/16, it also out performs the Hacker.

Dave.

Dave,
I will not be happy either if I only get 1000 watts. I was hoping for more like 1200. Do you remember what your all-up weight was with that set-up? Was it a total dog in the air or just a little underpowered? RS

Russ, with that motor my angel was 6lbs 9oz and it was a dog to me, others called it underpowered. With the scorpion motor it is a couple ounces lighter and is in the 1200watt range static, more in the air! FYI my axi 4130/16 with the same battery and prop flew my fliton inspire at 7 lbs with authortiy at about 1150watts static. I like the scorpion best, Hacker the least of the three. You may find otherwise. Just my experiences.

Dave.

I don't use MotoCalc as a "bible", it's just a starting point but I have found that it is quite accurate (within 10% - 15%) with the stuff I've run through it. I imagine there are errors in the data, which may influence the outcome, I have a habit of always verifying the data for each component before calculating the result.

As for the Axi 4130/16, MotoCalc shows decent numbers though not as good as the Hacker A50 12L but then I have 2 Axi 4130/16's, in fact I have one on my Fliton Inspire, an almost identical plane to the Angel in weight and size and I definitely feel the Hacker is outperforming the Axi. I love Axi, don't get me wrong, it's just a sizing-to-power-to-weight-to-efficiency thing...

Jack

The nice thing about MotorCalc is the error is fairly consistant so gives a good starting point as you say, being able to put all your different combinations in one table is very usefull for comparing as well.

We have three Angel's in my club, two with the Hacker A50 12L's and mine, my Angel outperforms and fly's longer than the two Hacker powered examples, I truly believe the difference is that I am using 4350Mah 25C FlighPower LiPo's and they are using an inferior brand, will not mention the name otherwise we will start a brand war, and this site has been extreamly civalised up to now, don't wish to spoil it.

Mike

Russmall,

Remember the part about taking 10mm out of the motor box, hopefully you read the build thread and are prepared for this step (assuming you went with the "L" series hacker)...

Jack

Actually we're not looking at the recommended A50 16S but the A50 12L (more than windings here, the "L" cans are 10mm longer and can handle 1,650 watts versus 1,250)...

Jack

Mike,

I couldn't agree more, it's more that battery than the motor. You can take a dog and make it into a demon by just changing the battery. I use FlightPower 6S 5000 packs (I also have 5350 and 6600 packs which I fly in my Inspire 60, the 6600's add a major kick over even the 5000's, the difference is maybe 15% more kick by adding capacity only) and I have unlimited vertical and can easily hold a constant speed through sequences...

Jack

Actually,Russ never stated what motor he ordered! Yes, I am aware of the difference between the "S" and "L" Hacker motors.

cheers Dave.

This was brought home to me on my smaller 3S planes, using a 2500Mah 20C in my Sebart Katana the preformace was very good, but as soon as I got hold of some 2150 25C's the performace was outstanding, including longer flight times, this could not be by the lighter weight alone, but by the higher discharge rate available from the 25C battery allowing me to use less throttle control during the flight a noticable increase in power with less stick, Oh isn't this a wonderfull hobby? and the development in battery technology has improved things no end.

I couple my 6S with a 4S to give me 10S in my 2.1 Composite Edge, would you credit it the weight comes out at 13.5Lb and the thing fly's beatifully up to nine minutes of 3D flight and 12 mins of pattern.

Mike

Dave,
I guess that I totally screwed up, but I ordered the recommended A50-16S. Now I'm not sure what to do. I can either go ahead and try it and hope for the best, or send it back and order a more powerful motor. Why would SebArt produce such a nice airplane, and then recommend an inferior power system for it? I don't get it. I have one other electric airplane ( 3D Hobbyshop 55" Extra 300) and the power system they recommended for it was perfect. Anyway, I'll let you guy's know what I decide and how it works out......RS

Russ, There was no screw up I also bought that Hacker a50-16s because it was recommended. Who says it will not work for you? I just posted MY experience with it. You may find it works for your style of flying, or your setup may be better! Personally I would send it back and get the Axi 4130/16 or the Scorpion 4025-12. both will fit without mods to the mount.

Dave.

Russ

I would not discount anything that SebArt recommend, the plane is so good I am sure there recommendations are as well, the only reason I am using an AXI is that I had it already, so was the obvious choice for me.

If you go the AXI route the back mount will need a small amount of file work to line up the holes for the installed T nuts in the bulkhead, mine is now about four years old and has seen out, I think its 12 LiPo packs without a hiccup.

Mike

Hi,

I've got the standard Hacker motor in my Angel and she flies great, very impressed. I take off on just over half throttle, then go vertical rolling as I go up. It is 3D capable with that motor. My cells are Flightpower and Thunder power, I do believe the make of cells can have a significant difference, along with how they have been used. IF they are new cells then use them for a few cycles to get the best out of them.


Sarah

Nothing wrong with the recommended Hacker A50 16S, I just think you should size a motor with some overhead and that one tops out @ 1,250 watts. It will work fine, give great performance as well but in the long term both it and the Axi 4130/16 will burn out sooner (I say this from personal experience with both) if you routinely push them beyond the recommended watts. Why not size with room to spare is all I'm suggesting...

Jack

Guy's,
I decided to go ahead and try the recommended set-up with the Hacker A50-16S and I flew it today for the first time. The airplane flies absolutely perfect for what I was wanting it for, Pattern practice. All up weight with 3700 mah 6S pack is 6Lbs. even. I had my timer set for 7 minutes, which let me fly the intermediate seqence with a couple of minutes to spare. The batteries had plenty of juice left in them, so I think they could go 8-9 minutes easy. Most of the seqence was flown at half throttle with extra power added on the up lines. I'm very happy with this airplane!!! RS

Congrats! It is a sweet flying plane...

Jack

Hey all,

I'm thinking of getting back into pattern after about a 14 year break. Looking for an electric ship that will fly well on 6s power. Is the Sebart the one to buy?

Thanks!
George Mohr

P.S. Joe L, you still watching this thread?

I'm at Muncie right know. When I get back you can have a crack at my Angel S

U da man! Good luck and kick butt.

-G

George

Have a read of this thread, I don't think you will find a bad word said about the plane, its the most accurate flying plane I have and that includes comparason with my 2M Composites, not purpose built pattern ships, but never the less the comparison to those planes shows how good it is.

Mike

Morning all,
To all Angel Pilots in the UK.
I had a small accident the other day, as i took out the wing retaining screws, I sneezed dropping it in the grass never to be seen again!!!
I went on the web for a nylon 4mm bolt and found modelfixings sell bolts which have a knurled portion and can be hand tightened
meaning you don't need a screwdriver and its easier to put together at the field. Here is the link :- http://www.modelfixings.co.uk/nylon_...tm#thumbscrews
Product number = MF-NTS04/2 for 2 bolts or MF-NTS04/10 for 10 bolts.

brgds
Dave