Anytime!

Let me be clear on my reason for deciding to put a gasser on this bird. I don't place all the blame on the engine flaming out because it is glow. I have been wanting to go gas for some time but got a good deal on the Moki. It just needs a pump(I think) and some reworking of the fuel system which is my responsibility as the builder/pilot. The ZDZ was offered to me at a very good price so I am going that route versus the tinkering with the Moki but only because I have the opertunity to do so. I am sure the gasser will require a fair amount of set-up as well. I plan to use the Moki on my next project, a C.G. 1.20 Sukhoi. I have used glow engines for the entire time I have been into r/c, about 6 years with great success, lots more positives than negatives and will continue to do so on smaller models. If I came across as bashing the glow engines I certainly didn't mean to and mean ABSOLUTLEY no offense to anyone. This is a great thread and I certainly don't want to detract from that. As I stated when I posted about the maiden I love this plane and can't wait to fly it again no matter what engine it ends up with. One of the great parts of this hobby is the challenges it presents and the learning that comes from overcoming them and I consider the whole flame out issue a learning experience that will serve to further my interest in this awesome hobby.

I really hope I didn't step on any toes and if so I greatly appologize
Thanks again and happy fly'in,
Rod

I know just how you feel. I started mine out on the 160 and then switched it over to a BCMA 40cc because I also wanted to try gas. It's really not much trouble to do the swap. With the gasser I got to put all of the servos in the tail where I wanted them. A 50 would really rock this plane but the 40 flies it very well also. Good luck with your conversion and if you need any help shoot me a PM or e-mail. Bubba can tell you anything you'll ever need to know about this plane and a gas engine also. Good luck!!

How does the BCMA run? I see they are lots cheaper than other brands. DO YOU recommend them? Thanks, maybe I too will skip the Moki and try gas, just didnt want to spend $600 on DA 50 right now.

Right now BCMA are switching all of their engines over and have nothing in stock yet however, If you go to the Wild Hare site and check out the 3MM 53cc you'll find an engine that is inexpensive and very good. BCMA was selling them as a MT 52 Pro but is switching to a newly originally designed engine that is a month or so out. I have one of the 3MM engines in my 16 pound 10 ounce WH Edge 540T V2 and it is very powerful and runs great. It would power the snot out of the CAP. Dawghouse RC also sells them for $390.00. Post #637 (page 26) has a link to the maiden on the Edge with the 3MM engine in it. The engine puts out 25 pounds of static thrust on a Vess 22A right out of the box.

There is a guy at our field that has a BCMA 50 on a C.G. Ultimate bipe. I don't know the scale but it's pretty big, probably 72" w.s. and it rocks that plane. Take into consideration he is probably the best pilot out there. He absolutley swears by it and replaced a D.A. 50 with it. Funny thing, Most of the "good old boys" at our sight are tainted against the D.A.'s but all I've ever heard about them is good but they sure are pricey. I think some of the lesser known manufacturers are stepping up their game to get a bigger piece of the pie. If a company puts out a reliable product AND backs it up with good customer support they're in the game. Me personally, I'm not a "name brand" kind of guy. If I can get a comparable engine to one of the big dogs and save $200.00, hey, the cowl covers it up anyway[8D].
As always, it pays to do the comparison thing. That said, would I buy a D.A....heck yeah! That's why I love this sight.

The ZDZ is in the mail. Hope to put'er up next weekend.
Happy flyin' all.
Rod

Yeah, the Wild Hare Edge has a 7 foot wingspan and is much larger then the CAP when setting side to side. I've read several comparisons on here between the DA and the 3MM by guys that fly DAs and they all love the 3MM. When the new BCMA 50 comes out next month I'm going to pick one up to try out but, at the moment, I'd say the 3MM is the best deal out there I know of. It hovers my Edge at 1/3 throttle. BTW Here's a shot of the 3MM in my Edge and a preview shot of the new BCMA 50 due out next month.

Al

well if the BCMA flies it well, then the ZDZ 40 F3a at about a 1lb less, should work very well.
I am stll on the ropes as to iff I want to purchase this plane...??
@ 13 lbs how does this fly compared to nerest competitor the Bling 3d?

Will a 40cc give enough poer to pull out of howers with plenty to spare?
COuld you give a update?
Isay your maden vid but I didn
t see any hovering(heck it wasonly the first flight)

I don't know a thing about ZDZ engines but I can tell you the 40cc SPE I bought from BCMA (this is NOT the new souped up model) will hover the plane but it will not pull it out with great authority. This could be due to the fact that it's still not broken in. I really don't fly it that often. I plan on flying the plane this weekend so I'll try and get some video of what it will do.

Flew the CAP today with a Xoar 20X8 Beech Ply prop turning 6600rpm with 19 pounds of static thrust. Plane hovers at half throttle with power to pull out of a hover slowly. Keep in mind that this engine is not broken in yet. I think if you want an engine to pull out with the kind of authority you're looking for you should go to a 50. Just my opinion. Once broken in, I'm sure this engine will pull out of a hover nicely.

Well, forget the ZDZ for my bird due to deal gone bad. It just never showed up and the seller isn't responding. However, I have in hand a BME 44. The really cool thing is the way it mounts. It uses the same mounts as large two or four stroke engines. I held it up to the mounts on the plane and it looks like it'll drop right on with only a slight amount of adjustment of the mount and a hole in the fire wall for the carb. One question, will I need to do somdething to direct air to the venturi or will it get enough from inside the motor box? Would holes in the side of the box be enough? I don't want to weaken the structure too much. I've been putting together my new C.G. arf Sukhoi but now that I have this it's on hold and I'm back on the Cap Work has been brutal busy but with enough evening time I hope to put'er up again this weekend.
All you gasser guys jump in and help this rookie!
Happy flyin' all,
Rod

You should have at least one half inch between the carb and firewall, more is better if not cutting out a hole for the carb. Or just cut a hole that is the same size of carb's venturi in the firewall directly behind the carb, usually a one inch diameter hole will be more than enough

Hi guys, I've been keeping up on the thread as much as posssible, I have the cap as well with an os 1.60.
Perhaps you remember Bubba, I had the issue with the fire wall not being glued in from factory, and I never double checked.
You had mentioned Bubba that you pin your firewalls, Could you explane to me how to do this?
I have rebuilt the entire fiewall and engine mount(this took a while, as I have been flyuing for about 3.5 yrs now but there are no clubs around here so I have had to learn everything the hard way)
Any how I have it built and ready to fly but I would like to have a litle more security on landing that it doesn't pull out again and poke holes in my wings with the wheel pants[:@]
Any help would be greatly appreciated.

I'm pretty sure it won't happen know again as in the fuse above and below the fuel tank I molded blue styrafoam to fit and glued it in with Gorilla glue and than put two wooden dowels above the tank as well as below, glued them in to the styrafoam and then threaded the ends and bolted the firewall to that
I know how much weight was added, about 2oz, but I had 2!/4oz on the tail befoe anyhow, so worked out good.

Sorry for the long thread, but thought I should explane what I did.

Actually you did pin the former in. Pinning the firewall is basically the same thing. You could use toothpicks, 1/8th inch dowel rod (my favorite) or wood screws.

Basically, if you use the dowel rod you drill 1/8th inch holes on all sides of the firewall, I'm talking about the piece of plywood that you actually mount the engine to, make the holes about 1/8th to 1/4 inch deep. Now put some 15 minute or longer epoxy in the holes and on the dowel rod and stuff the rod into the holes and wipe away the excess glue. Cut the rod flush and there ya go. On the Cap I did 3 each side. I base it on the engine size so most 50cc engines get 3 per side, 100cc engines get 4 per side and 150cc+ engines get 5 per side.

If you use toothpicks then the hole should be the same size as the toothpick with the pointy end cut off or if using small wood screws then no longer than one size smaller than the screw itself. Use epoxy to help hold in the screws as well and certainly use epoxy with the toothpicks.

I wish I had some pics for you, it would make it easier

Great explanation on the pinning Bubba and thanks as well for the advice on my gasser. Brendon, one thought on pinning. I always pin my firewalls as well. One thing I started doing some time ago was to use roll pins. You drill the sides just like Bubba instructed but use 1/8" metal roll pins that you can get at Home Depot. Even though they are metal they are hollow and weigh about the same as hard wood dowels. When you drive them in they compress and trust me, they aren't coming out unless you want them to. If you ever decide to make changes to the firewall like a different engine that you need to shorten the box for, You can remove them with an e-z out or thread a wood screw into them and work them out with pliers. Either method will give you the added strenght you're after.

Best of luck on your reflight.
Rod

roll pins,

now that's a cool idea. I'll try that on the one I'm currently doing

Thanks guys, I pretty sure I understand how you do that, anyhow Had it out last night and remembered why I LOVE this plane.
So smooth and graceful, looks good on the ground and in the and then..........BAM high rates and look out she comes alive!!!

Hey all.
Starting the engine swap tonight. will a 4.8v 1100 mill pack be enough for the ignition? Also, as far as the ignition switch will a Cermark heavy duty with charge jack be okay or do I need to go to something else.
Thanks,
Rod

Guys i have a question. I have this plane with a fuji 43cc on it. of course metal geared servos. It flies great but wants to nose out in a hover. Is this a torque problem or balance? My experience with a smaller cap a few years ago i had to get it really tail heavy to really 3d it but it still never hovered good. I am running a 20X8 wooden prop from lhs. I think it is a zinger. Exectly where did you balance it on the wing to get a good all round 3d performance?

Thanks curtis

Curtis,

This plane has that problem as it has too much downthrust. Add a washer to each of the bottom engine mounting bolts which equals about one degree of upthrust

If you are talking about the on-off switch for the ignition, it is no different then running a switch for your receiver. In fact, I run a 6V on my receiver pack and a 4.8 on my ignition so I guess there is even less current. I have standard receiver pack switches on my CAP and MPI switches on my Edge but have never had, or heard of anyone, having issues. Don't know about the other guys.

Bubba, if a check it woth an incedence meter, will the engine be 0 degrees in relation to both wing and stab? thanks.

I never checked mine so I cannot say with any certainty. I usually assemble my planes then run through a bunch of trim flights to get what I want then start mixing things out in the radio which when all said and done I may have 20 to 40 very short flights I'll change the main wing incidence, change engine thrust, etc...

I can say this much, both of the GP Cap's I've owned needed upthrust as well as the GP Ultimate. Spinning a 22x8 I needed two degrees right and one degree up above what is already built into the firewall. With a 20x8 on he Fuji I needed one and one so if you take the standard size/thickness washer it gives you approx one degree for each washer width so in this case add one washer to both bottom mounts and the top left (pilots side) mount (right side when facing the front of the plane)

Bubba, Flew the CAP last weekend with the 40 and a 20X8 Xoar prop turing right around 6700. When I put it into a hover it wants to pull over to the left every time. Do you think some more right thrust would correct that?

Al

Yep...I'll bet on a long upline it pulls hard left near the top if not before and possibly towards the gear which would indicate too much downthrust as well.

Get the lines to go straight and the hovering get tons easier.