Alright, so I'll see how it goes and might try and get the saito before I shoot for my radio. Make the radio a fall savings project .
This twist looks like it's going to be a blast once I get some power behind it.
-Eric

Good form DownT,, Good form I say,, now thats what I like to see, When I went to our Not so LHS a couple of weeks ago, the guy there told me Kits were a thing of the past, he just about floored me, he has the biggest shop I have ever seen, but is running out of kits, I told him thats whats wrong with the hobby these days, to me there is nothing like the satisfaction of building a bunch of sticks that looks great and what a feeling when she soars to the sky, I understand a lot of people just don't have the time, but I say make the time and stop sleeping... you make me proud Down.......

The OS 70 4 stroke has awesome power,, and I use the 14x4 on her too, but for a real thrill of speed,, slap a 12x8 on that puppy and there is nothing that can touch that plane in the sky.

Alright, so 2 questions here... Kinda not related...
Does the Twist have potential as a highspeed plane without any modifications? I mean, the surfaces won't start to flutter around 100+mph will they? Could I stick a 10x8 prop on there and get some high speed also? (my buddies all have really fast planes and sometimes it's cool to keep up with them... i can out maneuver them but if i go to chase them down it doesn't work so well with that 12.25x3.75).
Also... does anybody know of a downloadable model of the twist for realflight g3? I know it's like asking if you can put a ford engine in a chevy, but I want this plane on a sim to get an idea as to how it should fly. I guess I could wait for FSONE but it doesn't exist yet
-Eric

Sure, the T _ _ _ T can go fast................... once. I'd love to know how long it would hold together with a 10x7 going all out. Let me know the time in seconds, ok?

Peace

Downtrodden

LOL, that bad huh? It seemed to hold together fairly well under the 11x6 but I think I'll keep it sane.
Anybody know of a G3 model that represents the twist? I tried to modify the extra special but I can't get it to do the crazy aileron coupling like the twist does. Any suggestions to make it couple like the twist does?
-Eric

Decided to go over the Twist top to bottom in the shop last night. I tweaked the CG back a touch, and increased all of the throws on the control surfaces by moving the control rods to the inner most on the control surfaces, and the outer most on the servo arms. I also cleared out my radio, and reprogrammed both high and low rates with new expo and dual rates.

I took the advice of you Michigan boys and on high rates went 140% travel with no negative expo. I will have to learn to fly the plane again, but I need the super fast reaction and the extreme throws to advance my hovering skills. I feel like I have platued the last 30 flights or so. I think this will help a lot. On low rates I bumped it up to 100% control throw from 50%, and 35% negative expo. This is what I was previously using on high rates. Since I never used low rates, I am very familar with this set up. I can always click to low rates while learning to fly on the no expo high rates when my nerves get frazzled, or at least for the first few landings.

The 13x4 prop is working great on the OS .61 FX for hot weather flying. I don't notice a huge difference. I have increased my RPM and airflow over the engine significantely. I think speed has increased a bit, and thrust has decreased slightly. Now I need 5/8 throttle to pull out of a hover instead of 1/2. Oh well, I guess i will just have to suffer through until fall!

Adam

Eric, I have found Twist drivers are just a tad wiser, more clever than the run of the mill "speeder." So don't speed up the Twist, just stand on the line with those fellows. They HAVE to come back to the field--and paybacks are a witch, hm?

Nah, don't do that. The Twist is a Lady, graceful and talented. Speed is nothing compared to her. So treat her like the Lady she is and let the speeders go green with envy.

By the way, I have seen two idiots over power birds, then fly them too fast. I had a .61 OS on a Can Do .46 and flew it for a long while like that, slow, until one day I was waaaay across the field, down wind, and decided to bring her back fast, WOT. The starboard elevator (on its own servo) shook violently, and before I could throttle back, the tail all but came off. Fortunately, the ailerons overpowered the weird new plane and I brought her home. Rick has an Extreme 540 with an OS .61 on it. His son speeds and so had gone through THREE sets of servo gears, two on the elevator, one on the rudder.

I have to say, Waldo, Down did a fine job on the Impress. I saw it... more than a year ago, bereft, unfriended in his shop. And she flew so sweetly in winds gusting to 25 mph. I don't recall a high wing plane that could do as good an axial roll. The Magic can, for sure, but none other I know of.

He says he's gonna fix ALL his bereft and unfriended birds, a bunch. Then he'll make some flying mistakes as I did, going between birds, betcha. Don't tell him he's gonna need a new radio to cope with all those birds. On the other hand, maybe that's the reason for all the fixing: he can then justify a new radio. Ha.

J

The T _ _ _ T is a 0 to 25 mph bird, in my opinion. Picture a belly dancer.....now speed that image up......pretty wicked huh? Slow and graceful.......a seductive striptease........now we're talking!

Adam, you're fortunate you live where you do........it's so cold there in winter you'll probably need a 24x4 prop just to keep heat in that engine! Imagine how that plane will perform! (That is if it doesn't shatter into confetti as if dipped in liquid nitrogen!)

Peace

Downtrodden

So, does anybody think the evo 46 could swing a 13x4w? That's into the range of expensive props so I don't want to try it without knowing it'd work. I guess I could just save my pennies but I just would like to get every bit out of this setup that I can first. I would try a pipe but that's about 1/3 the price of the saito. And I just can't justify the extra weight anyway. I'd be better off with a .61 at that point.
-Eric

Eric, I've never owned an Evo .46, but I wouldn't think that prop would work. Once awhile back in this thread, someone was asking if a 13x4 APC (not wide) would work on an O.S. .50. I opined that it wouldn't, but to be sure, I tried it. That big prop caused all kinds of problems with the .50. It would barely turn it over 10,000 rpm and the needle became ineffective. The engine started getting hot.

Howdy guys I haven't read or posted here for awhile . I been flying my Twist now about a month with a 11x5 prop on an OS .46 AX and have just started flying on high rates last couple trips to the field . I love this plane I can see why why there is such a long thread and so many Twist lovers . I haven't been flying long and with CG forward the Twist is easy to fly . My question is I went today and got the 12.25x3.75 prop so many have used and I want to know will my AX engine be able to turn that size ok ? I am doing good flying it with the 11x5 but I want to try what so many here have used . Will it be harder to fly and handle allot different ? I am doing good and don't want to go to the 12.25x3.75 if I am not ready . I am not doing any 3D stuff just normal aerobatics . Are take offs and landings any different ? I don't have the $$$$ to go to a bigger engine which I don't think I am ready for yet anyway . Thanks guys . It is because of all of your love for the Twist that made me get one ( I actually have 2 One the RTF I havn't flown yet ) .

Bruce

Hobie, congratulations, great that you love the Twist. Rick, one of our flying buddies, has an OS AX and is using the 12.25 x 3.75 APC prop. He loves it. He also has a re-built Twist with a Super Tigre .45--with the same prop. Does well. His teenage son is showing us all up with that bird.

And read my review of the Twist PNP, with the Evolution .46. I changed out of the break-in prop and put the 12.25 x 3.75 APC on her right away. So the answer is, yes, your AX will handle the APC 12.25 fine. Just watch the heat and the weather. The new prop won't "challenge" your flying in any way. You may not notice ANY difference, but you WILL have to retune the high end. You may notice that the 12.25 spools up slower than the 11x5.

If you're not hovering, you won't notice much difference 11x5 versus the 12.25, but the latter is, in a sense, a lower gear. You won't take off as fast with the 12.25, nor go as fast in the air (you don't want speed with a Twist). So the changes will not be great, the flyability unchanged. But see for yourself and let us know.

Best wishes,

J

Review of the Twist PNP, Evolution .46NT package:

I received the PNP yesterday at two pm. It was in the air by 1:30 pm today (might have been earlier except for charging the 700mAh bat that comes with it). The first thing I noticed was the short arms on the servos and knew I wouldn't like them. Worse, I have no JR-type long servo arms so had to use what they gave me.

The plane was fine, except for some dimpling of the Ultracote, fixed with a hot iron and blower. When I measured the distances between the wing tips and the elevator tips, the whole scheme was right on, within 1/32th of an inch. Likewise the fin was perpendicular to the fuse. The plane was aerodynamically perfect, except for one slightly bowed aileron, fixed with a heat gun.

I installed the charging receptacle, separate from the on-switch, only to discover my Futaba female plugs don't fit it. You spend the most time setting up the servos with this package. Everything else goes together in a hurry, especially, as in my case, if you've already built 8 Twist ARFs. I referred to the manual only to find something on the Evo .46--nothing, except a reference to "read the Evo manual that comes with the package." None.

I maidened the PNP alone. 80 degree temps, 65% humidity, winds gusting to 23 mph. The engine started immediately and ran through a tank. Without the Evolution .46NT manual, I called Horizon and a tech said break it in with an 11x6 prop. But he said the engine doesn't really need a break-in. (?) The pre-set high end needle doesn't turn more than one full turn, weird. For break in I turned it full rich, but it only took a half turn to fine tune the high end for the maiden flight. I wonder about that needle--and there's no hole in the cheek to deal with the low-end breather setting. For all that, the engine transitioned well and didn't flame out, though the low end needs some tuning. I have a drill.

So after the first tank, I installed an APC 12.25 x 3.75 prop (which the tech said was fine), and put her up. Two clicks of "up" elevator was all she needed. [The CG came in at 5.25, so I added an ounce and a half weight to the drive shaft. She maidened at 4 and 7/8ths--so tail heavy.]

In high winds it's difficult to "read" a plane, but the PNP flew well and the .46 responded well, no flameouts even with my inverted, through outside loop, to hover maneuver. Very good news for me.

I got her to hover in the wind. Got one full revolution of torque roll. But the deciding factor on this bird are the small throws! They are HALF what my other Twists have with long, Dubro arms and S3004 servos. So 3D flying is a challenge, esp. in the wind.

Eric, there's your problem. The throws are minimal--and I have mine, with given equipment, set at the OUTSIDE of the arm and the INSIDE of the horn, maximum for the set-up. I have no longer JR arms, but I'll order them right after this missive. The plane's a punk, a trainer, without those throws!

Consequently, this bird flies predictably, like a trainer, and easy. I landed cross wind twice, then came through the trees to land upwind just to see how she floated--with a CG at 4 7/8ths. NO problem. She flies like a dream.

I couldn't get a good inverted spin, but the throws and the wind were ag'in me. I hovered her at high alpha in the wind for a long time. There was no falling off on either wing. Loops into the wind were perfect. Knife edges needed just a little aileron mixing (because of the wind?). The plane is aerodynamically sound--which holds much promise. I flew her at 100% throws after I trimmed her, two minutes--and for the next two flights. Then the rain came, and I had to close up shop.

This bird, even with minimal throws, shows the identical snap right my other Twists have when given full up elevator.

Without serious throws, she's just another plane. Without dominant tail feathers (rudder and elevator), she's no 3D bird, I'm thinking. On a calm day… maybe. [Who has "calm" days?] But I'll fix this bird with longer servo arms, THEN see how she does.

You have to love the absence of yellow/pink/purple.

More later.


J

Pix: See the PNP on the table with 1.5 oz weight on drive shaft. Note the vertical fin and horizontal stab relationships.

Try again.

And again.

Sorry Jack, but your "Secret Plane" isn't a secret anymore! The color change is nice, but as you know I'll not be sending any more of my hard earned cash to Horizon...Someone has to make a stand when it comes to poor service, don't you agree? "Those that have been screwed, unite!"

Peace,

Downtrodden

DownT, that Super Impress is as cute as a bug. Does it have ailerons? The .15TT was light enough so some lead could be removed from the tail?

Jack I tried to go back & look @ throws you use on the twist but can't find them. What are the settings you use.





_____________________________________

If you remember the 70s you weren't there

Jack:
i have 45 degrees of travel with the HD dubro arms so that's not my problem I think it was a combination of misaligned ailerons and not enough throttle input. I can't wait to find a day that's calm now.
Your review is spot on by the way. I think I did manage to get a friday night or monday morning plane though. The tail was misaligned and the extention going to my rudder was NOT plugged in properly. All in all though, a really well built plane. You can't beat it for the money
And I should also add that my CG came in right at the reccomended 4.6 or so. I don't really remember where but it wasn't as far back as yours is. Is your receiver or battery mounted in the forward compartment behind the tank? I'm curious to know why our CG's differ so much.
-Eric

191557,

I found the Illusive plans, finally. Hope you are an experience builder as there is only one page for the instructions. I looked in my kit to see if it had more than what came with the plans. If it did I would make you a copy but the kit has the same one sheet of instructions. It does not look to hard to build even with the one page.

In any case if you still want them you can have them. PM me your address info. I just ask that you cover the cost of shipping. They are rolled up so I will get a shipping tube unless you just want me to fold them and send in a large envelope. Up to you just let me know in the PM.

Yes, Eric, I left the plane just as it suggested, for the placement of bat and receiver. I have NO idea why the planes should come out so differently for CG--perhaps our methods for determining CG.

I'll leave it as is for now. Seems to fly just fine, though I would like to see the white spinner on. Maybe a calm day will be different, worse, somehow. I could probably find room for the bat in the forward tank compartment.

Glad to hear you've got the long arms. I have NO experience with JR equipment, so don't know how they'll handle the weight. They SEEM very quiet, however, compared to the S3004s.

J

557, I've never measured my throws, but they are as much as the HD Dubro long arms, hole furthest out, and the standard Hangar 9 horn, furthest hole in, can get me. The rudder only barely clears the elevator halfs on full throw.

For most of MY maneuvers, I need a commanding tail section. I suspect that's why I enjoy the profiles I have, with their short tail moment and large tail surfaces.

Gaw, Tim, you should have seen him adding weight to the NOSE to get that Impress to balance. And first he changed a battery position to far forward. Not enough. That bird's supposed to have an electric and a VERY heavy bat up front, methinks. But with Down you could put an anvil in the tail and it would still fly.

Down, sorry you missed the maiden--not that exciting except for the colors against the dark clouds. I never got the "lady in waiting" up. It started raining.

I had one problem with the PNP I failed to mention. The fin and rudder were poorly glued at the base of the fin. It took all of a minute to squeeze parts together and CA them. But I won't look forward to flying the PNP until I change out the rear servos--adding long arms--so I'll AT LEAST have some tail command. Supposed to rain tomorrow, so I may get the chance.

Tim C,

Is that a Four Star? Do you have any problems with the black covering? I'd also love to see a few pics of your field box/ airplane stand, wow! You must have built that 4*, as I don't recall them offering it in that color in an ARF . Was it a pleasure to build or did you have to fight it all the way? I have a 4* 60 that's been sitting around in kit form for over 2 years.........if you say it's worth the time, maybe I should get busy building. What do you say? I have an O.S. 91 FS that would fit nicely in the front too.....how do you like it's flight characteristics? Questions....Questions....Questions......

Yes! The Impress does have ailerons. I've used a single Hitec HS 81MG for the ailerons, two Futaba 3004's for the rudder and elevator (I'm saving my other Hitecs for a special project) and a HS-55 for the throttle. I had mounted the battery quite a distance back thinking that's where it was needed, but was I ever wrong! I initially added (just to see what was needed, never intending to fly with that much) 2-1/2 oz of lead in the nose to balance it out! I have since removed all the added weight and just moved the battery as far forward as I could (abutting the firewall!) I haven't weighed it yet, but I'm guessing the all up weight to be 1-3/4lbs. I haven't flown her since the other day, but I'm expecting 11-13 minutes out of her 4 oz tank. (She flew for six minutes the other day on a hair more than half a tank, but that was fighting 25 mph winds, too.) This is the smallest glow-powered plane I own, but I have a few engines all the way down to a Norvel .049 RC just looking for a home.......any ideas? I would love to see a 1/2A airframe similar to the T _ _ _ T.


Peace,

Downtrodden