I know what you mean when you describe how you were treated by some of the people that answer the phone over there but because we have all had the misfortune of getting some real smart asses from time to time. Best thing to do is give everything time to get mailed out and try and get what you can from them to lighten your money load to get the plane back in the air . I bet Horizon will make it as right for you as they can . I hope you get it fixed and get flying again...this is the reason my wife never tried to learn baring the fact I can be hard to learn from and the money it cost if something happens.

Perhapse we are in the 0.1% not the 0.01% ?

What kind of a deal are you going to make on the Saito?

Good for you Rottielover, it seems like you have softened a wee bit, thank you.
I completely agree with you that .01% is in line with any company's standards.
Sad when it happens to you, makes you (and me mad as he**, too).
If ever in your life you had less than a stellar day, perhaps you can forgive the customer service rep who was having his.
I think we all know that no customer service rep can make a determination on a refund/replacement without management involvement. Regardless how you feel you were treated, you were going to speak to a supervisor absolutely before this matter was settled either to your satisfaction or not.
And FWIW, I too have a real sweet spot for that new 150 Mustang.
And just happen to have a Saito 150 looking for a home....

Here is a flame for you. You better grow some thicker skin because if you let one rotten apple "ruin" your experiences in life then your in for a long road of pain. You have to keep in mind that this rep probably hears complaints all the time and it is difficult to assess what's legit and what's a scam. Airplanes are unique in the fact that if they fail in flight there is always going to be that doubt as to pilot vs mechanical failure. Shoot I could get my cousin Cooter to write a letter till he was blue saying he is an expert yahda dada da in RC but the fact is there are no RC credentials to prove who you are or what experience level a person is at.

I can't imagine returning a plane to my LHS unless there was hard evidence of something faulty and even then it would be a hard sell. They would go out of business in a hurry if they refunded/exchanged every time someone crashed an airplane. Anyways, enjoy your flame.

Next time I am in a car accident I'll say the steering wheel was stuck. "Look go check it out you will see " LOL
Maybe they will give me a new car.

Exactly, I had hard evidence, I cannot see how a ride in the back of the UPS truck "magically" fixed this servo.

Next time your car has a manufactures defect tell me what they do.... They repair it don't they????

The point is that unless there is a "known" defect I wouldn't be able to prove it after a major accident due to the damages from the crash. Unless something obvious happened like the car bursting into flames prior to impact? Ouch




I hear UPS does wonderful things.

Rott,


I'm not going to take a stick to this dying horse much more, but a good point has been made. Customer Service, good or bad, is a human endeavor. Mistakes are going to happen, and even the best people screw up from time to time.

After re-reading your post, it was as clear the second time as it was the first that you were dissatisfied with the end result. I did not at all get the impression that the point of your post was that you ran into a horse's ass and then had your problem later solved, fairly if not generously, by someone up the food chain. I also have to agree that the only flaming I read was you flaming Horizon. After reading the subsequent commentary, it's easy to imagine that the first guy you talked to might not even have been as bad as you say, especially if you were worked up (not to mention emboldened by the guys at the field telling you Horizon owed you a new setup) when you called in.

Like some of the others, I've had some experience in the customer service arena, particularly in R/C. You'd be astounded at some of the ignorant, ridiculous and comical demands that customers walk in with after they just broke something. Yes, my old shop would have been out of business long ago if we so stupidly did the bidding of every one of those 'customers'. Funny 'for example':

Lady comes in on Dec. 26th after calling in to ask about our return policy. I told her, 'new, resellable condition WITH receipt' on the phone. When she shows up, she has a low-end RC truck that looks like a real truck ran over it. She tells me, very matter-of-factly, that she's very unhappy with her purchase and wants a refund. I couldn't help but look at her as though she had two noses and one eye. I politely asked what the problem was, and she told me that it simply didn't work. After examining the truck, I saw that several structural parts were completely destroyed, as though the truck had been run, full speed, into a brick wall. Also, there was mud in and on everything. I explained to her that it looked like that truck had been run pretty hard, and she angrily insisted that it had only been driven once, and very gently in a cul-de-sac. I asked whether or not it was a wet, grassy cul-de-sac, and she started in. She told me, through much foam and spittle, and through clenched, elongated canine-teeth, that if I didn't stop trying to rip her off, right then, that she would call the local news station's fraud-watchdog THEN initiate legal action. I couldn't help but smile, but I still tried to maintain some professional decorum. I showed her on the receipt where it boldly states that we did not accept returns on used electronic items such as motors, speed controllers or batteries AND that the box clearly warns that the truck was to be used ONLY in dry areas. She screamed back at me that her son was careful to heed the box's warning, and only ran it once in the dry cul-de-sac. By the way, this prudent son is six years old (box states that the truck was intended for kids 12 and up). So, even when I lifted up the chassis and turned it upside down to have about a handful of water pour out, she stuck to her guns about the gentle once-around in the bone-dry cul-de-sac. In the end, I offered to replace the parts at COST, and do the labor for free--OR I would kindly and swiftly show her and her busted-up, wet truck, the door.

Now, that was just an extreme example of what people in the hobby retail business have to deal with constantly. Am I implying that you behaved this way? Not at all. With all due respect, I am saying, though, that looking back on the whole thread, it seems that your expectations may have been a bit on the unreasonable side. This doesn't make you Attila the Hun. Anyone who's read a few of my early posts can tell you that I am often driven emotion, and prone to knee-jerk reaction, so I think it is good advice to cool out and then look back on it after some time.

Most of the people in this hobby are the type who'd rather help someone up than push him down. But--they're also opinionated! So, don't get mad at them/us/me for disagreeing with your assessment of Horizon or "what kind of company they are". Good luck!

My name is John Adams and I'm the Horizon manager that the original posting was referring to. From Rottielover's perspective, everything he is stating is absolutely accurate. Randy, one of our most experienced product support reps originally handled the case. When the airplane arrived, Randy personally checked out the radio gear but was unable to identify the stated servo issues or any other radio problems that could have contributed to a crash. Randy then had one of our long time radio technicians (Bruce) test the equipment. Bruce throughly tested every component and found each to be working correctly and within specifications. Randy confirmed with Rottielover over the phone the results of those tests and stated that Horizon would be happy to replace the airplane at a significant cost savings. If this wasn't satisfactory, Randy would discuss the case with his supervisor to resolve the issue. Unfortunately shortly after hanging up the phone, Randy became very ill with sever stomach pains and was out of the office for the next three days. I don't know if Randy's illness affected his ability to properly handle the conversation with Rottielover but I doubt it. Randy is in his middle 30's, a full scale pilot that loves R/C. He moved to Illinois to work at Horizon because of his love for aviation and the hobby. He's one of our most experanced, professional and humble customer service reps. I would like to believe that this situation was a case of unfortunate timing on our part. Had Randy not become ill I'm confident that he would have discussed the situation with his the customer service manager and Rottielover would have been called back within a few hours. I became involved when Rottielover tried to contact me. Unfortunately I was out of the office for several days competing at an airplane event and Rottielover was having a difficult time contacting me! I to personally tested the radio gear and was unable to find any issues. However, as everyone reading this forum knows, radio interference can and does occur. I felt terrible for Rottielovers loss and worked with the customer service manager to replace the airplane. To all those involved, I apologize for the mistakes that were made. At Horizon we strive to provide the best products and services. Unfortunately we sometime fall short of our customers expectations. If this ever happens to anyone reading this thread do exactly what Rottielover did and contact a manager. John Adams- Engineering Manager Horizon Hobby

Adams,

Greetings and Kudos. Keep up the excellent work. I'm sure that you, by reading the overwhelming majority of opinions on this thread, can feel proud of the job you and your people are doing. Thanks for chiming in!


Shaun Evans,
Formerly of Discount Hobby Warehouse of San Diego

Man! That was decent of him! Based on that, I think i'll go over there and order a Saito 180 for my DPM Ultimate.

I had an incident where I got to interact with Horizon customer service. I had ordered a replacement canopy for my Hangar9 80" Cap 232(nothing wrong with the original, the glue I used to put it on with didn't dry properly and it looked like ....). Couple of weeks went by and no canopy. So I called and spoke to a very polite lady who said that it had been delivered on such-and-such date. Well, I knew that I hadn't seen it, then I get a call from UPS, with the delivery date and time-to make a long story short, my neighbor, who is 85 years old, had recieved the package for me and forgot to tell me!!!
I immediately called Horizon back, told them that the mystery had been solved, and THANKED them for all the GREAT service.

That is why I continue to buy from Horizon-Great Customer Service!!

Keep up the good work guys and thanks again.

Dear John,

(Don't ya just hate to get mail like that?)...I appreciate your post and your honesty concerning the issue. You are just one more reason I like dealing with Horizon.

Keep up the good work....and how did you finish in the competition you were at?

Jerry

Hi again John,

I just want to make it perfectly clear, you are one of the best people I've ever had to deal with from any company. I want to thank you again for taking a personal look at my case.

But if you don't mind, would you ask someone to give me a call regarding the status of what's going on? The last person I spoke directly too at Horizon was Mark? (I think that's his name) when he told me that the Customer Service manager (Shane I think?) was out and Mark? is the one that told me that it was decided to replace my plane and fix the engine. That conversation took place on I think about the 20th maybe the 21st.

Again I apologize if anyone thought I was personally "flaming" them, and I'm gratefull that you try to see things through your customers eyes. I agree with several posters now, I shouldn't let one bad egg ruin things. I apologize for my anger.

Please understand, I swear on a stack, my mothers grave, my life, my first born son, my dogs, and all my airplanes.... that servo was locked up tight when I placed the plane in the box to ship it in. I swear to GOD.... and then the guys at the club all telling me "ya man that's a defect they should overnight you a new one" Heck I don't know any better, this is my HOBBY, I'm not that far "into it" yet where I know what's what, who's who, so on and so forth.

It also didn't help matters when my dad told me a day before Randy called "don't let them try and sell you one at reduced cost, that's BS", and then that's exactly what was offered.

well, I hope that helps explain somewhat, from my perspective

Not the airplanes. Nooooo.....

BTW- I've received several personnel calls and E-mails this morning all asking the same questions. Answers-Yes Randy is OK now and is back to work and #2- the airplane competition got rained out so we spent the time at the Dayton Air force museum. Also Randy informed me that he actually just turned 30 and is not yet "in his middle 30"! You guys are great! John Adams

It is about time someone stood up and did not accept poor customer service. If a servo locks up after 4 flight's, even in a roll it is defective. It is Horizon's responsibility to replace the entire kit due to the faulty servo. The instructer said the servo locked up soild and Horizon did not want to admit an error on their part. I still think Horizon sell's good product's, but when they make a bad one they should admit it. I have recently purchased the JR 10 channel radio and I am very happy with it. I plan to buy many more Hangar 9 airplanes also. Even though I love Horizon products and mainly buy from them, I can understand they sell some poor products also.

I respect what this man did for his wife and what Horizon finally did for him.