Newbie here - I posted the same question on the ARF/RTF section then realized that I should probably post it here in the NEWBIE section, duh! Ok, question:

I'm installing flaps on the F-22 Raptor (PTS) from Hangar 9 and I'm having issues. The inst. tell you to "just install them" and when I did, I get reverse throws (one flap goes UP, the other goes DOWN). I'm using Futuaba servos and a Y-adaptor but what gives?! Why are they going reverse? I could turn one of the servos around (physically) but this would cause me to modify the servo arm and the flap installation area under the wing. Much more work then the manual makes it out to be. I don't think this is what Hangar 9 intended.

What am I doing wrong?

Sounds like you have some kind of mix on your tx. What tx are you using.

You cant have the flap servos installed normally, and connected with a normal Y harness. You need to either have the flap servos in different channels, have a "reversing Y Harness" or flip over one of the servos like you mentioned.

Maybe I don't understand the question. Can't you connect the control rod on the other side of the servo so they both push or pull together. Sounds like it working like ailerons\
but I am not expert so take the advice of others.

The easiest thing is to install the servos so they both go in the same direction but at this point, since you already have them installed, a reversing Y harness is the easiest. Something like this:
http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products...ProdID=EXRA325

How did you hook up your linkage? With ailerons, if you have dual aileron servos (one on each aileron).. I don't have any idea how the PTS is setup, so I'm going blind here.. with dual aileron servos, both control rods are on "the inside" or "outside" of the servo (meaning, both setup with the rods closest to the fusleage or on the other side, furthest from the fuselage.

With flaps, one goes on the inside, and one goes on the outside. Then you can Y connect them and then reverse them as necessary to have either flaps (down) or spoilers (up). I will post a drawing shortly to show you what I mean.

CGr.

That manual for the F-22 explains this, and gives you 3 options.

[ul][*]Option One - Use standard servos and program a computer radio for flaps so that the servos move opposite each other.[*]Option Two - Use a reversering Y-harness to connect 2 servos to the flap channel.[*]Option Three - Use a JR ST47 standard sport servo and a JR ST47 reversed sport servo connected to a Y-harness plugged into the flap channel.
[/ul]

Ken

Just switch the arm on one of the servos

Humm, that is what I was trying to say.

THANK YOU SO MUCH, EVERYONE....I should have been using this msg board a long time ago.

Yeah, I missed out on the details of the instructions, I breezed past the "reverse" servo detail and went straight into the frustration level. For those wondering:

I'm using a Spektrum DX7 Radio (love, love it!) and for a while thought that my issue was the Tx and me not understanding servo reversing or other programming available. Then it dawned on me that you can't reverse (only) 1 servo when 2 are connected to the same line (Y-harness). Chalk it up to the newbie learning curve.

CGRetired: The F-22 has separate servos for each aileron & for each flap (exactly like your diagram), what I failed to realize was what RCKen posted; the instructions! LOL! Need to pay more attention I guess. So in essence everyones advice will work great - but I'm probably going to roll with what Misselman said with the reversing Y-harness since I already have both servos installed (and paid for!).

Thanks again everyone. Look for more post from me - I'm learning and loving this hobby!!! =)

RCKen

Where did you get the instructions for the F-22. I looked again at my manual and that is not in mine! Wow...no wonder I missed out.

Since you already have them installed, then, yeah, the reversing servo Y cable is the way to go. Just make sure they do what you intended to do before you fly the plane. Nothing like having the flaps working against the ailerons.. like ailerons in the opposite direction as the real ailerons. That could really confuse things!![X(]

CGr.

Since they're installed, the Y harness is the way to go.

I helped a buddy with his F-22 last fall, and we worked out the programming in his DX7 for individual hookups. It was a chore. Wound up in the Radio Forums finding out what options had to be turned OFF as well as which had to be turned on. We got it working about the time his reversing Y harness came in.

The mfg could have quite easily had you install the servos so only a regular Y would have been needed, but didn't bother. Or didn't understand the arrangement. ARFs can be quite annoying.

[link]http://hangar-9.com/ProdInfo/Files/F-22RaptorPTSLowResolution.pdf[/link]

Ken

i just got done doing my flaps. I bought the arf, my only problem is my cruddy solder job for the linkages. i need some practice. does anyone feel that the raptor seems heavy?

Yes it is heavy. If you decide on a .46 for power it will fly but that is all. I put a .61 GMS in mine and I'll tell you it is nice having the extra jam to get out of sticky situations[X(]

Yeah

And add those fake intakes to the weight. Clever touch. Add some large flat plates square to the airflow to match all the extra wood.

It is NOT a beginners airplane.

well that kinda stinks i was really hoping that engine would do a little more than just barely move it. i'm thinking about moding those fake intakes. the wife was poking fun because of the danger intake stickers next to them.lol. i might have to break down and go buy a new engine for it. i just bought a new saito 82 for the twist, so shes gonna be happy about that. notice the crossed arms in the picture.lmao. oh well. I will probably at least try it out and see this week hopefully i wont be on here next week with pictures of hangar 9 toothpicks.

I don't understand. Why would one use a reversing Y, instead of just using a normal Y and doing what Minnflyer suggested, running the control rods off of the same side of each servo, insetad of opposite sides. This is the way I've set up ALL of my flaps, and it works great. Reversing Y's are horrible. Everyone I've ever owned isn't worth a crap at holding center. You will be forever adjusting the pot on it. Even with them installed, it only requires you moving the control rod to the other side of the servo, and (possibly) lengthening the rod just a bit. I dont' really see it being that big of a deal.

Very true.

They all seem to use their own frequency generators that is clocked via a crystal.

In turn the crystal drifts with temperature changes, so no matter what you do you end up wearing out the pot's wiper arm contact points, resulting in progressively poorer centering & control.

I know in the arf, not only were the flight controls hinged and installed but control horns were mounted. i didnt feel like moving them, i know laziness. but the reversing harness was cheap and i really havent had problems with them in the past. my flaps are pretty dead even too. [sm=71_71.gif]

hey sourkraut,
i finally got the gms .61 on there, had to buy a new motor mount though. its funny though motor mount included it was still cheaper than the O.S. version. it fits nice i'll get some pics soon. did you have any problems with breakin. (i ran it a little above idle for two tanks.) this is my first ringed engine, and at full throttle it sometime cuts out. its like the fuel just shut off. i did read another post somewhere in this place about a 47 with a similiar problem and he put baffles in the muffler. but that kinda defeats the purpose of that tuned muffler. i believe you have the same style. i did have to had a little weight to get it to balance, im at the 5 3/4. the forward most cg point not real happy about that but at least its not falling back on its tail anymore. i also put a 11x7 with the same truturn spinner as before just had to buy an adapter for the thread size. i cant wait to see this thing go, but a little nervous about the engines intial reliablity. any thoughts?

just a note re the dx6i and mixing for flaps. flaps = aux, slave = gear. becareful after slaving the gear to the aux....because of the way the two channels operate independently. the gear switch does not seam to be able to be disabled with dx6i even after "mixing" to aux. the only way to disable it would be to decrease travel in both directions to zero...but with dx6i you need travel for"gear" in one direction for flaps. it is possible , therefore, to set mix up for flaps, but still operate the slave servo with the gear switch. depending on the setup, if you hit gear, you might overdrive the gear servo and fry it!. (like i did). what i suggest is setting up the mix without the "gear" servo plugged in at first, but just set it up by viewing it's range and direction of travel in the "monitor" view....this way you can make sure you set things up to operate properly without overdriving your gear servo( and frying it if its cheapo ds75 etc!). SO, if you only have 6 channels to play with, you can only operate one flap mix, and must therefore use a y harness for you two aileron servos. if you use a y harness for your flaps you need to have a "servo" reverse module to set it up for symetry for both sides.note: you can't just flip the servo arm and keep servo symmetry because the arm would be upside down....ie both arms need to travel in same direction for flaps unlike ailerons....using "reverse servo" in the transmitter only changes direction of throw as long as servo stays in same place, you cant just flip it in this case.....

i'm just rambling about this because the dx6i manual is crap, and i fried a servo and wasted hours figuring everything out.....i think the best answer is dx7 or bettter.

a further note to newbies like me: the values for "mixing" are the equivalent amount of mirroring travel you want from your slave vs master. kinda like dual rate/expo setting after you set main travel in "travel aDJUST " SECTION.

hope this helps somebody,,,,,on the other hand maybe i got it wrong? but this is what i experienced.

tugboat