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Welcome to Club SAITO !

Old 06-29-2013, 04:51 PM
  #25076  
Rudolph Hart
 
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ORIGINAL: RH

Old Fart...

I gave the e-mail address for Brian Winch a try, but it kicked back. Apparently that one is no longer in service. I'll keep hunting to see if I can get through to him.

Rick...
OOPS..my bad.FNQ(swineflyer)hit the nail on the head.Don't know if "bench racing" is a common term used in the states but over here it means getting together with a few mates at the end of the days flying over a few(sic)beers and telling each other how good you are etc.Naturally as the night wears on you get better and better,the nearest i can get to self perpetuating motion
Old 06-29-2013, 04:57 PM
  #25077  
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Try setting the LS needle with the HS needle at peak rpm setting. The needle effect each other so peaking the HS needle eliminates one variable.
Old 06-29-2013, 07:14 PM
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Old Fart, you are forgiven.  Just finished packing trailer with kits and model a/c tooling.  I had to use some cheater boards on the sides but it all seems to fit.  The models etc get loaded to morow.  I have set up my travelling computer so I will remain in contact with the world so all is progressing ok.  The springs on the VT are a bit suss, it has done 450K and I haven't seen fit to change them yet.  Will take the " full ash tray option" when I get to Brisbane I think to solve that one.
Amazing what you find when you pack, so far 2 x 50 litre containers of Dubro stuff, numerous pre 1975 Supre Tigre and Enya motoes, ED racers and Hunters, buts of an open rocker"something" a Kyosho Gee Bee Racer (not finished) and so the list goes on  I even have a Saito thrust washer sitting beside the computer as I type this.
The racing engines are in the shop at Rosewood and now all we have to find is the a/frame before start time in February.  Going to be as interesting few months. 
Old 06-30-2013, 01:37 AM
  #25079  
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Old Fart, I have just completed a deal that involved me swapping a ESM Swordfish plus MLE 53 gas engine for a Raptor Helicopter with spare engine and all radio gear (for my eldest boy) and for me a Hanger 9 Fokker DVII (ARF), which is NIB plus a brand NIB Saito 82 plus mount and genuine Saito 90 degree exhaust pipe, and brand new in packet Saito mount.  We didn't trade servos (all good JR stuff) but each left the additional fit out items in the respective boxes.  The Hanger 9 bird is now no longer built and best of all it will come in under 7kg so no permit required.  Will be used eventually to bring some teutonic order to my new club where Camels (flying variety ) abound.
Marvellous what a motivator moving is 
Old 06-30-2013, 03:16 AM
  #25080  
Rudolph Hart
 
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Hi mate reread your post sounds like awesome good news.We'll have to catch up and have a fly.Would the 82 go in the h9 camel swhein fluger?

ps the 'full ashtray option" over here means if you smoke and drive..when the ashtray is full you sell the car.And with the price of gas over here at the moment that's no joke.A full ashtray of cigarette buts here would cost you around 500 bucks and most of it gov't tax,my car cost me less than that
Old 06-30-2013, 03:35 AM
  #25081  
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Richard,

The TurboHeader should improve the performance of your 130T and your 65. Send me a PM so we can discuss it.

Jim
Old 06-30-2013, 07:29 AM
  #25082  
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ORIGINAL: Hobbsy

Try setting the LS needle with the HS needle at peak rpm setting. The needle effect each other so peaking the HS needle eliminates one variable.
Thanks for that. I now recall reading that somewhere but it slipped my mind. Old-Timer's disease!

John, I was surprised by the smoke trail at mid throttle but glad to hear it is normal.
Old 06-30-2013, 09:19 AM
  #25083  
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Hi all,

Thought this old Saito brochure might be of interest.

Regards,

Jim
Attached Files
File Type: pdf
Ec87975.pdf (5.06 MB, 31 views)
Old 06-30-2013, 10:11 AM
  #25084  
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Thanks Jim, very cool.
Old 06-30-2013, 10:48 AM
  #25085  
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I'm just getting used to a Saito 100. It's running an APC 15 x 6 prop and I'm at about 1200' elevation. What should I expect for WOT and idle with probably a gallon through the engine? I've gone through the tuning procedure and noticed the low speed needed to be leaned out quite a bit from where it was. For WOT, I richen the mixture about 200 rpm. At mid throttle, I leave a very noticeable smoke trail! Oh yes, fuel is Wildcat 15%. I did the low speed tuning without glow heat but I do use on-board glow when flying.
I'm still looking for numbers for slowest reasonable idle and for rpm at WOT. Also, how do I get the lowest idle? Right now the idle is about 2400 rpm and, with the 15 x 6 APC, the plane will not sit still on the runway. Since it is a World Models Chippie with retracts so the gear is back from where it should be, I cannot put drag on the wheels. As it is, I need to 3-point the landings to keep from nosing over!
Old 06-30-2013, 02:02 PM
  #25086  
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I flew the Sig 4 star 60 with the Saito 125. The model was able to balance by moving the battery compared to its balance point with an OS.91 FS. The aircraft is perhaps one of the most fun and agile i have seen. I recommend this airframe to anyone with a Saito 125 laying around. test was with a master airscrew 16x6 and wildcat 30% fuel. no tach just tuned via "ear." this enginehas been tuned before and used many times so it did not need a full tune when it was mounted on this plane.
Old 06-30-2013, 02:20 PM
  #25087  
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ORIGINAL: JohnB96041

Sounds like you have it on the nail head. I just returned from a day of flying my Funtana 125 with a Saito 1.25 4s. Half throttle left a beautiful smoke trail. At full throttle the smoke trail was a little less. I am using Wildcat 15%. Not much difference between the settings of the Saito 1.00 and the Saito 1.25. Keep flying and enjoy.

The reason for your smoke tapering off is probably due to the low speed being set rich, and the high speed being set closer to right on the money. The ls has effect to about 80% or thereabouts, so you are probably seeing it transition to the hs only setting when the smoke dies down at full throttle. You may be too rich on the ls. I don't know why, but my 125a is touchy to tune. My other Saitos are much easier to get right.

W8YE has had a lot of 125s and knows them better. I would be looking for a 2100 rpm idle at the one gallon point. You will have to lean your low speed where it isn't too rich. Jim says his 125s seemed to need about 3 gallons to be 100% broken in. I'm pretty close to that on mine with the same prop. You could be underpropped and need a 16" APC.
Old 06-30-2013, 02:34 PM
  #25088  
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ORIGINAL: blw

ORIGINAL: JohnB96041

Sounds like you have it on the nail head. I just returned from a day of flying my Funtana 125 with a Saito 1.25 4s. Half throttle left a beautiful smoke trail. At full throttle the smoke trail was a little less. I am using Wildcat 15%. Not much difference between the settings of the Saito 1.00 and the Saito 1.25. Keep flying and enjoy.

The reason for your smoke tapering off is probably due to the low speed being set rich, and the high speed being set closer to right on the money. The ls has effect to about 80% or thereabouts, so you are probably seeing it transition to the hs only setting when the smoke dies down at full throttle. You may be too rich on the ls. I don't know why, but my 125a is touchy to tune. My other Saitos are much easier to get right.
You are probably right on the ls being a little rich. Here in OKlahoma, yesterday, we were flying in 100 degree heat. Rather keep it a little rich in these temps. Idle is fine and high speed is fine.
Old 06-30-2013, 02:39 PM
  #25089  
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Od Fart, the 82 was what Col Taylor (himself) recommended for both the Hanger 9  Fokker and Sopwith. Only problem if you can call it that is with the trade I am left with a FG 36 looking for a home now, but I think it will be easily handled.Re flying come to the Gratton Do at Calvert next year, there will probably a class of flying to accomodate WW1 flying machines. 
Old 06-30-2013, 02:43 PM
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A rich ls will make a Saito run funny, idle too fast, loose power, and go through a lot of fuel. Getting the ls set close to correct is the number one priority with a Saito. Better to open up the air venting around it if you can. (Imo)
Old 06-30-2013, 02:50 PM
  #25091  
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For general use I agree with blw.  However I like a slight smoke trail in the climb ( mid range) because it indicates the engine is getting sufficient lubrication, but only a whisper mind you.
Old 06-30-2013, 04:15 PM
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That sounds about right to me. Just a bit.

I like the full ashtray option.
Old 06-30-2013, 05:07 PM
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ORIGINAL: blw

A rich ls will make a Saito run funny, idle too fast, loose power, and go through a lot of fuel. Getting the ls set close to correct is the number one priority with a Saito. Better to open up the air venting around it if you can. (Imo)
Well, I see what I need to focus on! Thanks for the advice. Fortunately, the engine is mounted inverted so there is plenty of air flow.

Overall, I'm quite pleased with the engine. It starts with just a touch of the starter. With my 2-strokes, I'm used to giving them a quick back flip, usually with the spinner, and they fire right up in the correct direction if at idle. I'm not sure how to do that with a 4-stroke, if it is even feasible.
Old 06-30-2013, 05:44 PM
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If you are brave and it is a good engine but replacement fingers and hands are hard to come by.  The only thing I start by hand these days is diesels (except the Enya 4s versions)
Old 06-30-2013, 07:37 PM
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That's why I flip the spinner, not the prop!
Old 06-30-2013, 09:25 PM
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ORIGINAL: RC_Fanatic

That's why I flip the spinner, not the prop!

my Saito 125 likes a 16X6 Master Airscrew. I am burning Wildcat 30%.

I always hit it with an electric starter. last time i hand flipped one it was disaster, but it did start!!
Old 06-30-2013, 09:36 PM
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I have a bent and scared finger the last time I was silly and hand propped a 65, God gave us electric starters and who am I to look a gift horse in the mouht.  But what ever spins your wheels.
Old 07-01-2013, 03:58 AM
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ORIGINAL: FNQFLYER

I have a bent and scared finger the last time I was silly and hand propped a 65, God gave us electric starters and who am I to look a gift horse in the mouht. But what ever spins your wheels.
A friend was leary of a new and untuned FA150. It almost broke MY heavily gloved fingers. Looked it up here and learned the back flip trick. Thanks guys.

Richard/Club Saito #635/FA100, 120abc, 130T, 180
Old 07-01-2013, 04:10 AM
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You have to learn to swing your fingers out of the arc.

Of course CDI eliminates the problem for me.
Old 07-01-2013, 04:27 AM
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ORIGINAL: SrTelemaster150

You have tom learn to swing your fingers out of the arc.

Of course CDI eliminates the problem for me.
Yeah, I have been bare hand propping for over 40 years, and have a few scars, but this bad boy backfired and caught my hand before I even got it turned over once. The kick back loosened the properly tightened prop nut and sent the prop and nut and washer flying.[]

I plan to fit CDI to my 180.[8D]

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