Bosco, Did you get your engines from DLUSA or somewhere else? Just would like to know if the problem you had is comming from Bob at DLUSA?

Bob and all who replied,

I decided to try a J-tech standard Pitts muffler. krypton wanted to sell his, so it was good timing, and saved me a few bucks. Thanks krypton. I am still going to find a canister plan I like and build one for the DL 50. For the first time build, I would like to build from a design that works on the DL 50. For now I just need a reliable engine muffler combination that will let me concentrate on my flying, and not worrying about my muffler engine combination. Noise isn't a problem at our field.

From what I have read in this thread and others, it seems as if the J-tech may be a little quieter than most of the other Pitts mufflers with less power loss than most. About the only drawback noted was the physical appearance of the muffler.

The TBM mufflers are all over the place on noise and power loss. It seems like no one has really verified an increase in power. A couple said the db didn't seem to be reduced.

It sounds like Slimline makes a quality product, but may be a bit heavier and more restrictive.

Bisson seems to be good quality for the money. Not sure about power loss or db reduction, on this one.

If anyone had a favorite canister design bookmarked, just PM me with it, it is off topic forthis thread.

Greg

Hi! I have bought DL 50 at www.peakmodel.com for my Spirit of Pitts , pictures here http://fotki.yandex.ru/users/papka2/
The engine has worked 2 hours on the ground and never flied with airplane. Work of the engine was astable and suddenly it has stopped. The compression has been lost. I dismantled the cylinder and have found the damaged piston, the cylinder and a ring. The engine does not work. I have E-mailed to 3 addresses at peakmodel.com ,but did not recieve any answer.

Where can I buy parts for this engine?I have information, that there are some manufacters of DL 50 ,and parts are incompatible.

I did not get the engine from Bob just the replacement parts,
One would think that all DL engines are built the same no matter who you buy it from, DL need's to get there quality control to a better level and consistency like most other contrys do,
I have a DA as well and you cant compare the two, they are different engines and price as well, My DL runs strong and reliable but I do not think it will last as long as my DA,

It's to early for me to defend DL based on the performance of mine after just two tanks of fuel (after reading the two accounts - the one from Russia (looks like something got into the engine from the intake or was left in the engine from manufacturing), and the other one about the poor bearing or crank fit), but if DL USA is supposed to be the authorized (by DL) US importer, I guess he's the only one who is obligated to honor any warranty claims (providing the engine was purchased from DL USA). (But maybe I'm mistaken and DL USA is not the sole, authorized importer.) I was talking to a guy at our field just last night who bought his DL from somewhere else and he said it came with instructions written in Chinese and no spark plug. I may be speaking "out of turn" here, but if something goes wrong with that engine I think he may have a hard time with any warranty claims or support here in the states. And without support (from DL USA?), I don't know whom one would turn to.

You are correct, Tim. The warranty/support issues are REAL, there is no doubt of that. DL as a manufacturer apparently sells to anyone (or any reseller), but also seems to only select a "few" actual "factory authorized distributors". Although the facts of these business arrangements aren't clear, or known (and I don't think they need to public, actually), the result is that some buyers get engines as have been described. It's unfortunate, but some are only really looking for the "lowest $$$", period.

I got into the DL's because of perceived "value" by me.... they appeared to have reasonable quality, good performance, and a "local" US distributor that I could actually talk to on the phone.

The DL's are not DA's, never will be, and have never been represented as such. They are "similar"....that's it, I think.

DL has been very receptive to feedback provided to them on improvements and have shown that they will make changes when needed. That's pretty good.

As for Peakmodel.... well.... I have BTDT, and won't do it again. Support is positively AWFUL to totally NON EXISTENT in my own experiences.

I've heard the same. [sm=thumbs_up.gif]

The compressions on my DL has not been good enough. The engine has abut 60 flights on it. It is quite easy to flip the prop over. The high RPM can reach 7000 on the ground with a Vess 22B but in the air it definitely does not deliver the punch.

Since I was thinking about replacing the ring anyway, I too the cylinder off. On examining the ring, I found there are several dark sections (aka ridges) on the exhast port side. It could be that the corresponding areas on the cylinder wall are not consistent and there is no chance for the ring to seal well. The anti-rotation pin on the groove of the piston is very tiny (compared to DA's) and the ring has about 5mm of rotation freedom.


Another problem is that boh threads on the cynlinder for muffler got stripped and muffler came loose during the flight, which happend yesterday. I would think it was caused by vibration?


So looks like some parts in my DL are not up to the standard?

Maybe you could have someone over-bore or rehone the cylinder, and get Frank Bowman to make an "oversize" ring?

Why not just buy a new ring and cylinder.

Parts are likely cheaper than the labour to rebore and get a custom ring made.

Im sure dlusa or valleyviewrc would get the parts checked over then delivered in a few days too.

Yep.
Lots o' ways to skin felines.
Some folks like to "customize" and "maintain".
Others like to just R & R parts.
Others still just ship 'em back and say "make new'.

Me again.

Well, six more flights this morning on my new DL. (Let's just hope I'm as happy with the engine at the end of the season or a year from now.)

Two things;

1. I used to think those guys who pointed the nose straight up after takeoff and continued to climb vertical were just showoffs. But now that I have a plane that will do that, I realize it's a combination of confidence (in your engine) and just plane fun!!!

2. Two words - prop noise! Now I know why guys have to throttle back when they're just flying straight-and-level! This thing sounds like a real airplane now - kida noisy, but it's all the prop. Maybe it'll be quieter when I get my Mezjlik (22 x 8). But the exhaust note is just fine.

Anyway, the thing starts on the first few flips every time and runs like a top (that means good). I hoped to run out the break-in fuel today, but I still have about another gallon to go - tomorrow I guess.

I also need to cut about two minutes off my fight timer.

My choke idea needs slite modification. After one of my flights I was peeking inside the cowl and noticed my choke wire is gone. I think it broke somewhere just inside the plastic tube that is glued to the plywood mount. I think the pushrod wire with the bent loop on the end was too heavy and musta caused too much vibration. I'll make a new one that is shorter and with just an "L" bend.

Well, so far so great!

yes, there are several options. Replacing the cylinder and the ring probably is the easiest. Anybody knows how high the anti-rotation pin is above the bottom of the ring groove? Mine is quite close to the bottom. I just do not know if it is normal to the DL engines.

Ok guys a little help is needed here. First some background, I have a 3DHS 85" Katana running a DL50 with hs5955tg servo's. I'm using 2 7.4v lipos through 6v MPI regualtor on seperate switches. I also have a lipo on a 5.4v regulator for the ignition running through a Jomar optical kill with all 3 switches being JR heavy duty. The rx is a spektrum ar9000 with an extra remote rx added, using an xp9303 with module for control. I have around 2 gallons of fuel through the plane and up till just recently no problems. First thing I noticed was flying at a local funfly the rudder kicked on the plane. Landed the plane and nothing could be found. I bought a flight data recorder a couple days later and 4 flights later, nothing happening, data recorder showing good numbers, nothing over 130 fades in a 10-12 minute flight. Thought it must be a fluke, around 6 flights later, the rudder kicked on the ground as I was moving out to the runway. Brought it back in, again nothing out of the ordinary, rolled back out and put it in the air, 5 minutes into the flight the rudder kicked again, so I brought it in. Now I'm showing high numbers on the data log. Changed out the rudder servo with a new servo, passed a range check motor off. The next time I'm at the field, I start the motor and start doing a little tuning cause I changed to synthetic oil. While I was adjusting the motor the rudder starts twitching and the throttle starts surging, in less than 3 minutes the recorder starts showing 346 frames lost, 0 fades on any of the antenna's. Shut the engine off and it's still twitching. OK so I take the plane back home and start going through the system. I changed the regulators, changed the switches, put a brand new JR DSM rx and remote, changed model memory, unhooked the optical kill, Used a different transmitter, used different battery on the rx (6v nimh), changed extensions, still no fix. At this point I called horizon, have spent over an hour with them, they're convinced its electrical. Called DLUSA, and was told it's vibration, not the ignition. Still can't run the engine without it glitching, throttle rudder and aileron. On the advice of a local club member, I changed out the plug and switched to a different brand of extension, was using Hitec HD twisted, now using JR HD and it'll pass a ground check again with engine off, but still can't pass with the engine on especially around low rpm and idle. Called DL again, and was told still don't believe it's an ignition problem, that it's a vibration problem, but I can send the ignition in and he'd check it.

Ok, if he's this convinced it's not the ignition it's got to be something else, I started it up running good everything is great, it's passing a range check for the first time with engine running, but I'm a little unsure of this so I let it run a few minutes, and just when I think I must be in the clear....... It surges and kicks the rudder.[>:], so I start unplugging servo's both ailerons, still kicks, and the frame numbers are climbing. Pull the elevator servo's, the twitching stops. Start plugging them back in 1 at a time, both elevators nothing, then the ailerons, starts surging again, then my engine BACKFIRES, it's never ever backfired before. Sounded like a pistol going off. I shut the engine off and now I'm here posting. I'm at a total loss and don't know where else to go now.

I need HELP!!!!!!!!!!

You will not like my suggestions, but they are based on experience.
1. Replace lipos and regulator with a 5 cell NiCad or NiMh or 2SA123-2300 battery going JUST through the JR HD switches on the RX.
2. Replace the lipo and Jomar optical kill (bypass all that crap) with just a REGULAR 4 or 5 cell NiCad/NiMh or 2SA123
3. Don't change anything else.
4. Run the engine. Do everything you can to make it act up.
5. Observe that all problems are gone.
6. Beginning with the ignition stuff, replace ONE piece of your original stuff, one at a time, until the problem reappears.

(You will find the Jomar and the MPI regulators need to be put in the round bin)

Ignition

Milton

Tried all that. Took the regulators out and put in a 6v nimh direct to the rx, no switches no regulator, still have it. Took the Jomar out and hooked up direct to the ignition with a nimh, still there. Horizons answer after the 2nd call was to put rf chokes on everything. I'm not above doing this, but I can't understand what changed after 2 gallons to be causing this, I understand that 2.4 can still be susceptible to electrical pulse, but it's not supposed to be taking hits from RF, and I really can't explain why it backfired on my this afternoon. A couple of the guys at the field are convinced its the igniton, but DL says it's not. I don't know anymore. The ignition is the ONLY piece of equipment that I haven't been able to isolate. I've got a qq 23% yak with the exact same setup, only differences are motor(evolution 26) and servos(jr 8411). Same batteries, regulators, switches, rx, etc. It's on it's 2nd season and never a glitch or problem. Got 6 1/2 gallons of fuel through that one.

Have you tried a different ignition?

Some time's the Pull Pull wire/cable can cause a problem with th RX wire and cause gliches,
The Pull Pull cable must be coated/insulated so that it won't cause interference, Some time a servo extention can cause a proble as well,

Find someone who has a good ignition use one off a Da if anyone has one in your area. I have seen the ignitions leak and could never pinpoit the spot. I found the leaky ignition when i touched the wire or the ignition box(It will give you a slight jolt).

A DA ignition will not work on a DL

Milton

Hi gr8taz nitro,

The DL has that crappy spring to make contact with the metal cap and the spark plug, and in turn then sends the voltage back through the ignition braded shield back to the ignition box. I always solder a wire onto the metal spark plug cap and then solder a round eyelet on the other end and then drill a hole in one of the cylinder fins and use a screw with nut to attach it. This way if the spring is not making good contact the voltage from the plug has a way back to the ignition unit. An intermittent spring contact can be causing what you are describing.

Geppino

Haven't tried a new ignition yet. Checking around to see if one of the locals has one I can borrow and try. Other option is to go ahead and ship this one in to DLUSA and wait.


Originally had dubro 4-40 coated cable, changed out to kevlar cable, no change. Have changed out all the extentions now. Was using HD braided hitec, now using HD JR, still no change.

Have checked for a good ground between the cap and the ignition using a voltmeter. Everthing checks good, doesn't matter if I have the spring in or not, ground checks good, take the cap off and no more ground.

I'm really starting to think that's what's going on.....however.......I'm allergic to pain so I'll have to pass on doing the wiggle check on the ignition while it's live, that does however give me another idea, check the ground while the engine is running. Have to try that in the morning.

I appreciate all the help guys. I keep thinking somebody else will come up with something I haven't. Sometimes you have to step back from a problem and another set of eyes might see something I'm not. Thanks again guys.

Maybe it's the transmitter? Try it on your Yak and see if there is the same problem.
It could be the rudder pot or a bad wire.

Wrap your ignition module in fine screen wire and see if your problem goes away, if it does it is your module.
Tom
Valley View RC