It appears to be a error on page 28 that wont let it load 90% of the time

Ira d

Thanks to your post we are now past page 28, Thanks... Now maybe the forum will continue.

Mike

I'm getting an error code "SpeedLow" and along with an engine shutdown at idle. Can't seem to find an explanation of this code anywhere in the manual. Can anyone fill me in on what this might mean?

Most likely a RPM sensor error. Check to make sure your RPM lead is not running along side other radio system leads. If the error still continues, you probably have a bad rpm sensor. SpeedLow means the engine is not maintaining minimum RPM, typically a sensor problem but could be a pump issue as well. Watch the engine at idle, if RPMs drop off and pump voltage is jumping around trying to maintain, it is a bad pump... If RPMs are erratic or show zero at any point while engine is running the sensor is bad.

What is the normal idle to max rpm acceleration time for the K-80? mine seems to take forever(almost lost plane on first flight on a trial approach, engine took forever to accelerate, as bad or worse than a P-80), based on everyone's feedback on the engine acceleration is excellent so mine should have a ECU setting issue, accel/deccel delays are at 4 so that's not the problem.

Hi Ruiz, you could dial down the acceleration delay (down to 0 if required) to advance acceleration just before your K-80 will make a growling noise upon acceleration. This pretty much will optimize acceleration performance for a K-80.

The rest, I think you need to talk to your dealer and/or experienced jet pilot.

Regards,
Barry

Well, my acdelay is set to 14 and I think it spools up very quick.

Megafly:

Whats your pump limit? Mine is 228, other than that the only other variable that would keep acceleration slow would be too high of a temperature and mine seems normal...

Could the problem be the pump itself? Is it slow to accelerate on the ground too or only in flight? If yes, I would think you could watch your PW value as you move the stick to full power, if the voltage to the pump is increasing appropriately then the problem is either your pump or a clogged line/filter or something inside the turbine. You might also want to check your throttle curve settings in both the Fadec and your transmitter.

I really do'nt Know what's my pump limit, I never have it changed.

Well it's foggy and 38 outside today But 0 wind...HMMMM by noon it's going up to a blistering 49. Yep going to burn some more Karo through the K-80f today!!! Joe Lewis and some other guys are going to are field to freeze and fly.. I'll make a video of us today... Thanks Billy D

Pump Limit does not have anything to do with acceleration. That fact that your Limit is set at 228 by the factory, tells me you do have the latest and most reliable MTH pump.

You mentioned "mine seems to take forever (almost lost plane on first flight on a trial approach.......)" could it be that you were not used to flying a turbine? I mean it sounds as if you were on idle upon the approach and expect it to accelerate at or towards the end of the runway. Even if an engine will spool up within 2.5 to 4 seconds, it would definitely seemed forever at a close call situation, furthermore, a turbine jet would not have the torque/acceleration response like a 24" prop job, nor thrust to weight ratio.

Apologies in advance if my assessment is false, and if so you are more than welcome to send your K-80 in for an inspection.

Regards,
Barry

Barry:

I'm already well versed on the FADEC programing, microturbine operation, engineering and repair, I'm used to programming FADEC units and doing conversions on several turbine makes, the statement about the pump limit affecting acceleration comes directly from Gaspar himself the creator of the software, I see no reason to doubt him. I have been flying turbines for several years so no I'm not ignorant on the matter, if I tell you the turbine takes forever to accelerate it is because it does. I ask others so I can use what's already done instead of tweaking my ECU, it is a new turbine and I see no reason to mess with . Other than the acceleration, everything else seems to be perfect with the engine..

The effect of Pump Limit on acceleration is limited, indirect or secondary at best, apologies if previous statement had misled. Please feel free to experiment with Acceleration Delay otherwise contact your dealer or us.

Do you have a serial number of this K-80? This engraved number could be found on the exhaust nozzle.

Thank you,
Barry

Can the K-80E be upgraded to the Kero start....May have been asked earlier in the post somewhere but I didn't see it.

Thanks

Barry, <div>
</div><div>I have the same issue with mine.  Spool up time from idle to WOT (10secs), other than that works great...  from 1/4 to 100% power though it spools up in about 2-3 secs.  Pump is MTH so its the latest...  I havnt been able to figure out any settings that will improve the delay so i try to stay in the 1/3-100% range prior to final approach.  </div><div>
</div><div>I have found that on final approach you need to be very sure before you cut the throttle.  </div><div>
</div><div>Regards</div>

For those having issues with acceleration times. Take a look at the engine temps during acceleration, If the temps are approaching the limit of 800C, the ECU will slow down the acceleration to compensate. You may need to pull the thermocouple out of the nozzle a tad, sometimes they get pushed in during shipping. The tip should only enter the nozzle by a few MM.
Pump limit Will affect acceleration but I don't believe this to be your issue.

One other thing to look at if you are having slow Acceleration is restriction in the fuel system.

First thing to check is the filter. On a new fuel tank and UAT system there can be micro particles that will block the filter after a couple of runs of the engine. The next thing to look at is the fuel lines and tubing you are using out of your fuel tanks. I have found that the 1/8 diameter brass tubing is too restrictive. I use either 5/32nd or 3/16th diameter on all my pick up lines and vent lines Including the vent line to the outside of the jet. It is a little more difficult to get these to go through the fuel stoppers but they will go through. One more note with the vent line, be sure that it is not too close to the top of the fuel tank. If your are using the D-Ubro or Sullivan tanks they too can be sucked down and block the vent line. Not too much of an issue with the Fiberglass tanks but be sure not to get the vent too close to the top of the tank as you can cause restriction there too. I like to put a short piece of fuel line on the vent inside the tank and let it run parallel to the top of the tank not 90 degrees.

Also the clunks on a lot of the ARF Kits are not drilled out for proper pick up I drill mine out to 5/32nd. One more thing is to make sure on the Inlet side of the Fuel pump (suction Side), is that you have a some what rigid fuel line from the UAT to the fuel pump. Too soft a line will tend to want to suck shut thus causing further restriction.

Hope this helps
Joe Lewis
Kingtech
K-80 and K-140
Owner

Joe,

I think you just gave everyone (new & old timers) some excellent advise on Turbine fuel system set up!!

Todd is also correct about the temp probe. I have had turbines sent to me for testing, and I have found the temp probes pushed into the tail cone to far, giving the ECU erronious readings. The proper distance the probe should be sticking out, inside the tail cone is 2-3mm only(on all KingTech turbines). It is a good idea to double check your probe while installing the turbine, to make sure it doesn't accidently get pushed/bumped in to far.

KingTech, USA
Dirk Flejter
Service Tech
[email protected]

Hi Rob, if the 10 second acceleration isn't an exaggeration, that means it takes 7 to 8 seconds from idle to 1/4 throttle, which is something I have never seen. Todd has an excellent point on keeping an eye on the temperature and temp probe adjustment if needed, but at the same time, I have not seen reaching peak temp during that first 1/4 phase of acceleration. Since you are in the Philippines, let us know if you would like to send it in to the factory for an inspection.

Barry

Fired up my K80F for the first time today. Everything was perfect. The start sequence was smooth and faster than I expected. The idle was stable at 45,200 and the acceleration/deceleration was pretty good, better than I expected. PW at idle was 55-57 and at full throttle it was 195.

Hi Barry, <div>
</div><div>nope...not exagaerating here..  Ffrom idle to WOT it will take around 10sec...  from 1/4 to WOT it takes 2-3 secs.  I dont know if its an accel delay, stability or pump setting issue, but if i bring accel delay down, it will start to bog/flameout.  I've learned to adjust for it by staying on the power until i am very sure of the approach.  </div><div>
</div><div>i dont really want to send it back to the factory at the moment...  i've been having a blast with it as it otherwise performs great!  </div><div>
</div><div>Regards</div>

Rob, if I remember correctly, the serial number of your K-80 is in its 200s, since then, K-80 made quite a bit of improvements without announcing, faster response and better fuel efficiency....etc. but still, I have never seen an earlier K-80 with the acceleration as you described. Nevertheless, I'm glad you are enjoying it, keep in mind, latest technology in K-80 combustion chamber design could be upgraded if requested on your next service.

nipmuck2, Upgrading from an E to F (kero start) could be done, but probably not feasible since so many parts would have to be replaced.

Regards,
Barry

Hi friends:

I made two videos for that you see my K80F, I think that the acelerations is too much slow and when I make the engine start and I pull up the stick before down the start motor run for make "cooling". This is normal ??? I have another turbines with Gaspar FADEC and never happen this. I look the pulse valor and is o.k. and the trasnmiter adjust is made.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sqabv...eature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sDdV9ucm7V4

I hope you tell me is this is normal or not.

Regards from Spain.

Carlos Márquez.
_________________________________
http://www.cmjets.blogspot.com/

Carlos,

I looked in the manual page 28 and it said: Manual cool down:
In the event if the engine does go into the cool down mode after the turbine shuts down or flames-out,
the user can lower the trim, and advance throttle stick to trigger cooling from starter.
So I think that answers that question, I hope.
I see you have a Futaba 14, how do you like it? I am currently using an 8FGS but needing to upgrade soon and the 14 looks like it would be great, other than the price.

Mike