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robart pin points on DP330L

Old 02-01-2003, 08:32 PM
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santi
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Default robart pin points on DP330L

I was thinking about replacing the hinges on my dp330l and was going to use pin points (robart). Would 3 for each surface be ok for the elevators? If not, how many?

Thanks,
Santi
Old 02-01-2003, 08:46 PM
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Flymyplane
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Default Hinges

Im kinda going through this mode too! I have a DP extra from the 2nd batch. I have installed 6 robart hinge points per aileron but have 5 CA hinges per elevator and 5 CA hinges on the rudder. These are the CA hinges included with the kit. One thing to keep in mind, you will need to add balsa blocks for the hinge points to adhere too! Otherwise the hinge points could pull out. This means extra work. That is why Im contemplating keeping with my CA hinges in both elevator and Rudder. Is anybody using the stock CA hinges? If so, how are they working out? Im using a gas engine, should I go with the hinge points? Or leave my elevators and Rudder alone? I have also thought about adding extra CA hinges or longer lengths between the installed CA hinges. I would add them, like adding a strip of ultracote to seal the gap? In other words, strip the ultraote at the hinge line, and seal the gap with CA hinge material instead of ultracote. The hinge would only be CA'd to the outside, but could add reinforcing strength?
Old 02-01-2003, 09:04 PM
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Kallikrates
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Default robart pin points on DP330L

I'm planning on getting this plane soon prolly the white arf so I can put my own trim and make it more unique and also because it will be able to color match any covering i strip off I may try and install blocking for hinge points on the ailerons and seal the hingegap I haven't heard any problems of flutter in the tail so I'll prolly use large scale pinned hinges back there.
Old 02-01-2003, 09:14 PM
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Default robart pin points on DP330L

i installed 4 pin points on my rudder last night. Boy was that a lot of work just peeling the ultracoat back then cut the sheeting off just to be able to get that balsa stock back there done that to the ailerons also. But now.....Should i do my elevators? I put in soo much time with the ailerons and rudder making sure that it dont look obvious at the field. Im thinking about putting 3 each elevators. These pin hinges are much more stronger than the stock ca that DP provided and im thinking that 3 would'nt hurt. But, I will still wait to see if anybody out there well tell me so......Until then I guess I will work on something else..

Santi
Old 02-01-2003, 09:22 PM
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Kallikrates
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Default robart pin points on DP330L

You happen to have pictures of how you did the wing? or at least post your process?
Old 02-01-2003, 10:15 PM
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Default robart pin points on DP330L

ok lets see.

1. cut the covering right on the center of the double beveled Peel back the covering just enough so i can get my 1/2x1/2 in balsa on the leading edge of the ailerons. Be careful not to rip the covering

2. Epoxy about a 1/2"X1/2"X1" piece of the balsa stock where you will put the hinge. there is one part on the ailerons where you will have to cut the 1/16" balsa sheet about 1-1/2" square at the end of the ailerons just so you can get that piece of balsa in there. Then glue it back in with ca. Well thats what i use

3. Drill a 3/16 just enough to get the hinge in. DO NOT DRILL ALL THE WAY THROUGH! At this part i trimmed out about 1/4 inch off the end of the hinge so it will not penetrate through the balsa block in the back. Don't forget to test fit it to your satisfaction.

4. Mix the 15 min epoxy and insert it into the holes. I prefer using something like a syringe Its called a monoject to get em into the holes. BE SURE TO PUT SOME TYPE OF OIL ON THE HINGE SO THE EPOXY WONT ADHERE TO EM. then insert your hinges in. Clean up the squeeze out and repeat steps 1/4 on the other side

When you do the wing portion you will have to cut out another square out of the balsa sheeting to get that block in.

Hmmmmm.......Did i leave anything out?

Hope this helps. Email me with you phone if you need more help at [email protected]

Santi
Old 02-01-2003, 11:38 PM
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Flymyplane
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Default Hinges

If I redo my elevators, I would probably put in 4 robarts for elevators and rudder (each surface). Three would probably do it, but 4 would be better! Im still thinking about doing it to mine! I just hate to have to start over and realign and glue and ...... so on so on! But then again, if the CA hinges aren't good enough, I will have to reglue the entire airplane! Anybody using the stock CA hinges? Please let us know what you think!
Old 02-03-2003, 06:20 AM
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Default robart pin points on DP330L

Just hinged my elevators tonight. Tried too, but couldn't use robarts...


The Elevator/Stab Tube gets in the way. (I'm not too creative so I stuck with the CA hinges.

Robarts on the Airleons for sure though
Old 02-03-2003, 06:34 AM
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Default OH!

Hey Wuudogg,

Glad to see you are making progress on the new DP! Thats a good point about the robarts. I have an H9 Cap 1/3 scale, that I had to cut a couple of the points down, to fit due to the tube. Do you think that there is enough room to cut the robarts down some on the DP? How much of the robart fit before it hit the tube? Oh well, doesnt, really matter now does it! ha! ha! You and I both have our elevators CA'd together. Im guessing you used the provided CA hinges by DP? I did robart hinge my ailerons using 6 pins per aileron, but had to add the extra balsa blocks! Dont forget to do that! Good luck with the DP! It sure is a pretty plane!
Old 02-04-2003, 02:46 AM
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Default final out come

welp after trying to install the robart pins in the elevators. I decided not to do to the fact of the tube getting in the way. What i did instead was, I went to my LHS and purchased some klett hinges and installed them. Had to cut then down a little bit but then drilled more holes so they will have more of a grab. My DP330L now is CA hinge free . I had to change them cause on my elevators they were beginning to rip i already had one fail so I had to redo all the hinges so here is what I ended up with

*6-pin points on each ailerons
*4-pin points on the rudder (kinda tough but worth it to get at
block in there)
*4-klett hinges on each elevators

I am now confident that there will be no more failures with my hinges. I hope....

[QUOTE]Do you think that there is enough room to cut the robarts down some on the DP? QUOTE]

There is only about 1/2" of balsa there before the tube. CA hinges will work fine, But klett hinges will work better......

Santi
Old 02-04-2003, 04:04 AM
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Default robart pin points on DP330L

Hi Santi,

Thanks for the info! You are replacing your CA hinges with Kletts, Im wondering how many CA hinges you had initially on the Elevators and rudder? Did you have 3 or 5 CA hinges installed before? Also, which or how many CA hinges failed you and which surfaces (only elevator?).

One more thing, were the CA hinges that you used before, the stock DP CA hinges that came with the kit?
Thanks!
Old 02-04-2003, 04:27 AM
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Kallikrates
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Default robart pin points on DP330L

Where are you all getting your klett hinges?
Old 02-04-2003, 07:31 AM
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Default robart pin points on DP330L

how many CA hinges you had initially on the Elevators and rudder?


I initially had the 5 in there.

which or how many CA hinges failed you and which surfaces (only elevator?).


I had one on the end of the ailerons and one on the elevators.
i normally do a preflight check on the hinges before each flight and when i pulled i noticed a little play underneath the sealed top and bottoms of the elevators and ailerons.

were the CA hinges that you used before, the stock DP CA hinges that came with the kit?


Yes.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Where are you all getting your klett hinges?


LHS=Local Hobby Store

Santi
Old 02-04-2003, 01:53 PM
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krayzc-RCU
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Default robart pin points on DP330L

i am running a brison 3.2 22 x 8 mezn on my 1st batch dp extra with ca hinges i keep a check on them i would use the blue ca hinges if i were to do it again. i have the white ones on mine and they delamited a few weeks ago on my dp bipe. the plane is still around to tell about it but one week i lost 2 of the 3 the next week the same thing on the other elevator side on the bipe. so far the dp extra all the hinges are holding strong. 1/4 scale blue ones would be the ticket...

i put pinned robat hinges 3 per on the bipe...
Old 02-04-2003, 09:47 PM
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Kallikrates
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Default robart pin points on DP330L

Just ordered a white dp extra hope its worth the 6 week wait
Old 02-04-2003, 10:06 PM
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Default robart pin points on DP330L

Don't hold your breath on the 6 weeks... but it will definately be worth it when it does show.
Old 02-04-2003, 10:58 PM
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Default IDEA!

How about this one? Since I already have the elevators and rudder installed using the included DP CA hinges, how about reinforcing the hinge line? We have to seal the gap anyway, Im thinking of using CA hinge material for sealing the gap! In between the already installed hinges, I will seal the gaps with more CA hinges instead of just ultracote! I will have to remove the covering at the hingeline first to expose the wood. I picked up some B&B CA hinges today (giant scale type), and Im thinking of trying it out. While these hinges will be folded to the crease, and glued to the Bevel on the outside just like ultracote, I feel this could reinforce the surfaces! I will then seal with Ultracote over this when done. I was thinking of only doing the under side, but now Im thinking of top and bottom, in two spots. This would allow me to ad a total of four hinges on each surface, top and bottom. If I did just the undersides, I would ad one per open spot in between the 5 already installed hinges.

What do ya guys think?
Old 02-05-2003, 06:34 AM
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Flymyplane
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Default Nope!

My last idea, is not so good! I experiemented on some scraps, and I dont like it. I also inspected my elevators up close with the original CA hinges, and Im not so sure that I trust them for that first flight! So, Im gona go at it, and install robarts at least in the rudder. The elevators, Im not sure yet. Man, what a bummer about the tube being in the way. The tube is probably in the way of at least the first couple of hinges. I will probably go looking for the Kletts and get away from CA hinges. The only other idea with the robarts, would be to drill through the metal tube and glue the stab down, and just install the robarts through tube. .....
Old 02-05-2003, 07:14 PM
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Default robart pin points on DP330L

flymyplane,

When you do decide to use the klett hinges on the elevators there are about two each elevators that you will need to trim down. When you do, you will cut past the 3 little holes. Be sure to drill more little holes as the epoxy will fill those holes. then insert. Be sure to grease the hinge portion so the epoxy will not adhere to the hinge. Good luck. Tell me how it went....

Santi
Old 02-06-2003, 06:20 AM
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Flymyplane
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Default Robarts

Well guys, I did it. I cut my rudder and elevators off last night to prepare to install hingepoints. Tonight, I installed the hingepoints in the rudder. Im using four hingepoints. I only added one extra balsa block, and that was for the top hinge. I was able to access this are from the top of the fin! I cut an opening just big enough for me to install a block, and sealed back up. As for the others, I think that there is enough meat to hold them. The bottom two are actually sunk in the fin trailing edge, and that 1/4 fuse filler piece. So Im pretty confident that they will hold. I used 2 ton 30 minute epoxy, with filler added for thickness. After inspecting the rudder, and not wanting to rip the covering back (boy Im tired of mods on this plane!), I think there is enough meat here also. Its probably about a 1/2" or so, but with all the expoxy gook, I think it should hold. At this point, it cant be any worse than those CA hinges that DP supplied! I stood fuse up as high as I could, to keep the glue where I wanted it, on the hinge!

Now, the elevators. Im planning to install four or five robart pins. I tested a hinge point last night in a piece of 1/2" balsa, using Thin CA. YOu could not twist it out with plyers! SO, I will probably go ahead and use my epoxy mix to install, and will probably put in 5 hinges just to be certain. It will probably take me a week to find the kletts, or anything similar, and the robarts are on hand at home. So, I will keep you all posted! At this point, Im feeling much better about it than with the CA hinges! It will be worth the effort. (Im not going to drill the stab tube!)

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